What do you think of this?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by edjen01

i am sorry that you do not feel i'm answering the issues. i thought i was.

i'll personalize it.....another church that actively targets people in my church to come to thier church...i do not believe i should concern myself with members of another church. does that answer the question?

no it does not. You obfuscated. The question was not "are you concerned about member of another church?"

The question is, is it unethical for members of another church to call members of YOUR church and try to convince them to change churches. Or for them to come to YOUR church service on the pretense they just want fellowship, then try to convince members to leave that church and join his church.

1) is it unethical?

2)if so would that congregation be a good congregation to be in?

3)if the pastor of that congregation allows such conduct is he being unethical?

4) If so, should the pastor of the targeted church try to keep the other church from causing division on his church?

they are not in my church for me to feed....so they are not my concern.

Again you are obfuscating. The issue is not the members of another church and whether or not they are being fed.

if they choose to do this, that, or something else....it is not my concern.

Again the issue is not what THEY chose to do. The issue is the congregation they are targeting

my plate is full caring for the ones God has allowed me to care for. if they are right or wrong....is not for me to say or judge....they are not mine....they are HIS.

Not the issue.

Should I be concerned about the saints I am pastoring....yes.

Should you be concerned that another church in town is actively trying to divide your congregation? Actively trying to take saints OUT of your congregation to fill their own congregation, not because they view them as lost souls as they are doctrinally the same. Do you think such a church would be a healthy place for YOUR saints to be in? Would you not be concerned that another church is trying to convince the saints under your pastorship away? When there is a whole city of lost souls to win?

See the issue is the saints you pastor, but yes you DO need to determine if such a church across town is a healthy church to be in for YOUR saints.

[edjen01]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

no it does not. You obfuscated. The question was not "are you concerned about member of another church?"

The question is, is it unethical for members of another church to call members of YOUR church and try to convince them to change churches. Or for them to come to YOUR church service on the pretense they just want fellowship, then try to convince members to leave that church and join his church.

1) is it unethical?

2)if so would that congregation be a good congregation to be in?

3)if the pastor of that congregation allows such conduct is he being unethical?

4) If so, should the pastor of the targeted church try to keep the other church from causing division on his church?


Again you are obfuscating. The issue is not the members of another church and whether or not they are being fed.


Again the issue is not what THEY chose to do. The issue is the congregation they are targeting


Not the issue.

Should you be concerned that another church in town is actively trying to divide your congregation? Actively trying to take saints OUT of your congregation to fill their own congregation, not because they view them as lost souls as they are doctrinally the same. Do you think such a church would be a healthy place for YOUR saints to be in? Would you not be concerned that another church is trying to convince the saints under your pastorship away? When there is a whole city of lost souls to win?

See the issue is the saints you pastor, but yes you DO need to determine if such a church across town is a healthy church to be in for YOUR saints.

1. i think i covered this in another post...but "NO". I would not practice or promote it...but I cannot make a blanket statement regarding what others may think they are suppose or entitled to do.

2. since i don't call it "unethical"...then I will not comment.

3. now you are asking me to judge another's servant...and I will not do this. He will answer to God for his teaching and practices.

4. i do not consider someone trying to get people in my church to go to another church a "division". this may be where we are speaking different languages. if someone chooses to leave my church...for whatever reason...why would I consider that division and not that God has something better for them? i do not consider this division.

Should you be concerned that another church in town is actively trying to divide your congregation? Actively trying to take saints OUT of your congregation to fill their own congregation, not because they view them as lost souls as they are doctrinally the same.{No. the other church is not my concern. if people choose to leave because they think another church is better...doctinally...better music...better whatever...why would i want them to stay? or try to guilt them into staying? trust that God will work all things for the good.} Do you think such a church would be a healthy place for YOUR saints to be in?{if they leave the place where I minister then they are not my concern. they are not my saints...they are His. He lets me feed, love, and care for them while they are at this time and place in thier journey. this does not make them mine. and when/if they choose to leave...i will trust that God will lead them on to bigger and better things.} Would you not be concerned that another church is trying to convince the saints under your pastorship away?{NO. i do not concern myself with other churches. if I have taught the Word with love...then I trust that the Spirit of Truth will help those in question make the right choice.} When there is a whole city of lost souls to win?

I hope I have answered all the questions this time.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by edjen01

1. i think i covered this in another post...but "NO". I would not practice or promote it...but I cannot make a blanket statement regarding what others may think they are suppose or entitled to do

Why not? Why not practice it or promote it if there is nothing wrong with it?

3. now you are asking me to judge another's servant...and I will not do this. He will answer to God for his teaching and practices.

No I am not. Im asking you to decide of such a pratice presents a healthy atmosphere to be in. Am I asking you to judge the strip joint owner if I asked "is it a healthy place to be"???

4. i do not consider someone trying to get people in my church to go to another church a "division". this may be where we are speaking different languages. if someone chooses to leave my church...for whatever reason...why would I consider that division and not that God has something better for them? i do not consider this division.

If someone is trying to GET them to leave is he not causing division IN your church? Why would you consider someone that looks at your church as a means of making theirs larger by actively, over and over and over calling those saints in your church and convincing them to leave your church? Or visiting your church regularly and convincing membes to leave? Why would you assume that was God having better things for them and not rather a wolf that does not care about souls but about numbers?

Should you be concerned that another church in town is actively trying to divide your congregation? Actively trying to take saints OUT of your congregation to fill their own congregation, not because they view them as lost souls as they are doctrinally the same.{No. the other church is not my concern. if people choose to leave because they think another church is better...doctinally...better music...better whatever...why would i want them to stay? or try to guilt them into staying? trust that God will work all things for the good.} Do you think such a church would be a healthy place for YOUR saints to be in?{if they leave the place where I minister then they are not my concern. they are not my saints...they are His. He lets me feed, love, and care for them while they are at this time and place in thier journey. this does not make them mine. and when/if they choose to leave...i will trust that God will lead them on to bigger and better things.} Would you not be concerned that another church is trying to convince the saints under your pastorship away?{NO. i do not concern myself with other churches. if I have taught the Word with love...then I trust that the Spirit of Truth will help those in question make the right choice.} When there is a whole city of lost souls to win?

I am not asking if you are concerned about "what the other church is doing" but how it affects YOUR church by over and over trying to get members to leave?

If you are entrusted by God to Pastor those saints, why would you have such a nonchalant attitude with this? That does not make sense.,

[edjen01]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Why not? Why not practice it or promote it if there is nothing wrong with it?


No I am not. Im asking you to decide of such a pratice presents a healthy atmosphere to be in. Am I asking you to judge the strip joint owner if I asked "is it a healthy place to be"???


If someone is trying to GET them to leave is he not causing division IN your church? Why would you consider someone that looks at your church as a means of making theirs larger by actively, over and over and over calling those saints in your church and convincing them to leave your church? Or visiting your church regularly and convincing membes to leave? Why would you assume that was God having better things for them and not rather a wolf that does not care about souls but about numbers?


I am not asking if you are concerned about "what the other church is doing" but how it affects YOUR church by over and over trying to get members to leave?

If you are entrusted by God to Pastor those saints, why would you have such a nonchalant attitude with this? That does not make sense.,

Praxeas....i do respect your opinion...and you are certainly entitled to it. I hope that you grant me the same. I have enjoyed sharing with you...and you with me.

I will not go back through all this stuff...mainly because i do not have the time.

I do take exception with your last comment. My calling and how I feel God would have me best love, care for, and feed those He has placed under my care....is what I must do. I take exception that you would think that I have a nonchalant attitude toward this simply because it does not make sense to you. The other side does not make sense to me either...but if thats the path you feel God wants you to take....then God bless and I pray you prosper.

its been fun.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by edjen01

Praxeas....i do respect your opinion...and you are certainly entitled to it. I hope that you grant me the same. I have enjoyed sharing with you...and you with me.

I will not go back through all this stuff...mainly because i do not have the time.

I do take exception with your last comment. My calling and how I feel God would have me best love, care for, and feed those He has placed under my care....is what I must do. I take exception that you would think that I have a nonchalant attitude toward this simply because it does not make sense to you. The other side does not make sense to me either...but if thats the path you feel God wants you to take....then God bless and I pray you prosper.

its been fun.

I didn't say you have a nonchalant attitude because it does not make sense to me. I said your nonchalant attitude towards this does not make sense to me. If those sheep are entrusted to your care then don't you care if they are being taught right, taught to act right?

BTW unethical
not conforming to approved standards of social or professional behavior; "unethical business practices

So you are saying this act, including the one of someone trying to take a friend away conforms to approved standards of social and or professional behavior?

I think everyone here agrees it is unethical, not necessarily immoral

BTW yes you are welcome to have your opinion but you can be sure if I disagree I am going to say so and why

[edjen01]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I didn't say you have a nonchalant attitude because it does not make sense to me. I said your nonchalant attitude towards this does not make sense to me. If those sheep are entrusted to your care then don't you care if they are being taught right, taught to act right?
BTW unethical
not conforming to approved standards of social or professional behavior; "unethical business practices

So you are saying this act, including the one of someone trying to take a friend away conforms to approved standards of social and or professional behavior?

I think everyone here agrees it is unethical, not necessarily immoral

BTW yes you are welcome to have your opinion but you can be sure if I disagree I am going to say so and why

while they are under my care...i am responsible for teaching them...so that burden would fall on me. if i teach them something that is not right...then I will have to answer to God for it.

when they decide to leave my care...i no longer am bound to them.

btw...i don't really believe that Christ-followers need to be taught to act right...follow Him and all that stuff works out amazingly.

regarding the terms "unethical & immoral". i believe you asked me if I would lable these actions "unethical & immoral"....and my answer was and is NO....your example about the friend...my answer was and is NO.

I will not lable others actions, who are not under my care. I'm not sure how much plainer I can make that.