Evangelist Dobson parts with Focus on the Family

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by notofworks

Plenty of liberal churches? There are a few, maybe, but by and large the Christian Culture is conservative. And certainly, the view of the Christian culture is that it is very much republican. The common perception is an expectation of political compliance with the "system" of Christianity. I'm frequently asked by religious cynics, "Are you guys gonna tell me who to vote for?", or "Do you accept liberals" because clearly, there is an expectation that all need to be conservative.

One of the problems we've created within American Christianity, is a closed culture to anyone not like us. Even if a UPC church never preaches "standards", if everyone in the building has complied with the code, the underlying message is, "You need to conform." The same thing happens with conservative politics.

I wouldn't ever want you to walk away from your political opinions, just like I wouldn't want I wouldn't want a liberal to do so.

And true, Dobson is not a pastor, but that's really beside the point. He is very much an acknowledged voice of the Christian Culture and he speaks for the culture as a whole.

I, too, see frightening trends in the government but I don't think it has any effect on the church at all. In fact, historically the church has been at its best when opposed the most. The underground church in China is growing at a faster rate than anywhere in the world.

A little opposition might do us some good.

I can assure you that the majority of churches in DC were openly preaching "Vote Obama" from their pulpits.

I don't expect anyone to change their political views. Last week I took nearly half a day off of work and sat in the Ethiopian Embassy to get a young lady's passport and visa and overnight them to Florida. She was on part of a mission trip that was leaving the next day, and I assure you these folks are very Liberal. A friend of mine from law school called and said is there anyway you can do this for us? She is the most liberal Christian I have ever met, both politically and in terms of Christianity. After spending 2 months around her in Europe when we were studying International law she said to me, "You are the first person I have met with conservative viewpoints that isn't legalistic and judgmental."

We are still friends and christian, and still have totally different political views.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

I can assure you that the majority of churches in DC were openly preaching "Vote Obama" from their pulpits.

I don't expect anyone to change their political views. Last week I took nearly half a day off of work and sat in the Ethiopian Embassy to get a young lady's passport and visa and overnight them to Florida. She was on part of a mission trip that was leaving the next day, and I assure you these folks are very Liberal. A friend of mine from law school called and said is there anyway you can do this for us? She is the most liberal Christian I have ever met, both politically and in terms of Christianity. After spending 2 months around her in Europe when we were studying International law she said to me, "You are the first person I have met with conservative viewpoints that isn't legalistic and judgmental."

We are still friends and christian, and still have totally different political views.

I understand. DC is one of the most liberal cities in America. Most churches in the town I'm sitting in right now, San Francisco, would probably encourage the same thing. But it's the exception, not the rule. The last survey I read had 78% of American senior pastors as registered republicans.

My main concern in all this is the perception of the unchurched person. I want them to be able to walk into a truly political neutral zone. The overwhelming reputation of American Christians is that we are homophobic, bigoted, exclusive, pious, self-righteous republicans.

I guess I see the mission of the church is to comfort the broken-hearted 15-year-old girl that's just had an abortion rather than protest the clinic where it happened. And I have the feeling you're on the same page with all that.

But WHEW, Baron, I thought we were gonna have to step outside there for a minute.

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by notofworks

I understand. DC is one of the most liberal cities in America. Most churches in the town I'm sitting in right now, San Francisco, would probably encourage the same thing. But it's the exception, not the rule. The last survey I read had 78% of American senior pastors as registered republicans.

My main concern in all this is the perception of the unchurched person. I want them to be able to walk into a truly political neutral zone. The overwhelming reputation of American Christians is that we are homophobic, bigoted, exclusive, pious, self-righteous republicans.

I guess I see the mission of the church is to comfort the broken-hearted 15-year-old girl that's just had an abortion rather than protest the clinic where it happened. And I have the feeling you're on the same page with all that.

But WHEW, Baron, I thought we were gonna have to step outside there for a minute.

Well you know, "Jesus is happy when some people get their faces bashed in."

I agree "protesting" an abortion clinic is pointless. I agree supporting a crises pregnancy center, or adopting one of those precious babies is where the rubber meets the road. I do participate with tens of thousands of Catholics when they have the Right to Life rally in DC though.

[coadie]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

Well you know, "Jesus is happy when some people get their faces bashed in."

I agree "protesting" an abortion clinic is pointless. I agree supporting a crises pregnancy center, or adopting one of those precious babies is where the rubber meets the road. I do participate with tens of thousands of Catholics when they have the Right to Life rally in DC though.

People like yourself can contribute when the new health plans begin to dictate that workers of healthcare are required to violate their conscience and perform services that they have moral objections to.

Model Conscience Clause
The rights of conscience of any person being a duly licensed pharmacist, who shall object on personal, ethical, moral or religious grounds to the performance of any act in the normal course of professional performance or dispensing, shall be respected.

TO AMEND CHAPTER 41, TITLE 44 OF THE 1976 CODE BY ADDING ARTICLE 5 SO AS TO ENACT THE "HEALTH CARE FREEDOM OF CONSCIENCE ACT" TO PROVIDE THAT HEALTH CARE PROVIDERS, HEALTH CARE INSTITUTIONS, AND HEALTH CARE PAYERS HAVE THE RIGHT NOT TO PARTICIPATE IN OR PAY FOR A HEALTH CARE SERVICE THAT VIOLATES THEIR CONSCIENCE, TO PROHIBIT DISCRIMINATION AGAINST A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER, HEALTH CARE INSTITUTION, OR HEALTH CARE PAYER FOR DECLINING TO PARTICIPATE IN OR PAY FOR HEALTH CARE SERVICES THAT VIOLATE THEIR CONSCIENCE, TO PROVIDE IMMUNITY FROM LIABILITY BY REASON OF THE HEALTH CARE PROVIDER, HEALTH CARE INSTITUTION, OR HEALTH CARE PAYER DECLINING TO PARTICIPATE IN OR PAY FOR A HEALTH CARE SERVICE, AND TO CREATE A CIVIL CAUSE OF ACTION FOR VIOLATIONS AND A MINIMUM AWARD FOR DAMAGES.