Hell's Best Kept Secret? Ray Comfort

[SDG]

To appreciate one's salvation one must also appreciate what one was saved from .... and please don't say everyone is seeking relief .... some do not know their standing before God ... unless they repent ...

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

To appreciate one's salvation one must also appreciate what one was saved from .... and please don't say everyone is seeking relief .... some do not know their standing before God ... unless they repent ...

What people need to repent from is from godlessness....yeah, that very subtle sin that goes unnoticed....there are many good samaritans that are good nature people, they volunteer in their community, they give to worthy causes....they are living with peaches and apple pie....there is nothing ugly looking about their life....but when they find out about their separation from God and that the only way to enter eternal life is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ...they realize that their "goodness" and "good samaritan" way of life is not enough to enter heaven....then they need to start making some important decisions!


Too many people think they are good...that the good things they do is enough....we need to reject this self-righteous and self-centered living! We need to look at the cross to understand where our righteousness comes from!


People need to understand and be aware of godlessness....a life lived on ones own rather than centered on Christ.

Originally Posted by J-Roc

What people need to repent from is from godlessness....yeah, that very subtle sin that goes unnoticed....there are many good samaritans that are good nature people, they volunteer in their community, they give to worthy causes....they are living with peaches and apple pie....there is nothing ugly looking about their life....but when they find out about their separation from God and that the only way to enter eternal life is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ...they realize that their "goodness" and "good samaritan" way of life is not enough to enter heaven....then they need to start making some important decisions!

And they will never know they need to repent from such godlessness if we keep preaching a nauseating "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life" false gospel.

Too many people think they are good...that the good things they do is enough....we need to reject this self-righteous and self-centered living! We need to look at the cross to understand where our righteousness comes from!

All the more reason why the approach Keith Green, Ray Comfort and others have taken is the right approach.

People need to understand and be aware of godlessness....a life lived on ones own rather than centered on Christ.

And they will never know they need to repent from such godlessness if we keep preaching a nauseating "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life" false gospel.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by J-Roc

What people need to repent from is from godlessness....yeah, that very subtle sin that goes unnoticed....there are many good samaritans that are good nature people, they volunteer in their community, they give to worthy causes....they are living with peaches and apple pie....there is nothing ugly looking about their life....but when they find out about their separation from God and that the only way to enter eternal life is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ...they realize that their "goodness" and "good samaritan" way of life is not enough to enter heaven....then they need to start making some important decisions!


Too many people think they are good...that the good things they do is enough....we need to reject this self-righteous and self-centered living! We need to look at the cross to understand where our righteousness comes from!


People need to understand and be aware of godlessness....a life lived on ones own rather than centered on Christ.

Godlessness is one of the many sins people must repent of ...

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Godlessness is one of the many sins people must repent of ...

Amen, but least anyone forget, the topic is not How to convert the converted....it's TRUE and FALSE conversion...in other words it's about what we preach to the sinners.

Law to the proud and grace to the humble

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by keith4him

I have heard him in the past, but didn't pay much attention, but the other day I was watching one of notable religious channels and Ray was teaching on false converts (basically people in church that don't bear any fruit of righteousness), boy I took notice and started taking notes. Profound and powerful. I made an outline of it to share with my church! I needed to discover the art of deep repentance, and when people experience that and stay there it makes good disciples. Also it exposes the fallacy of the doctrine that come to Jesus because he will make you happy,give you purpose, fullfill your deepest longings, etc., instead he will save you from your sins.

Originally Posted by J-Roc

HUH? Surely, you cannot be serious that it is fallacy to believe these things?

Yes, Jesus saves us from our sin...but are we coming to him because of the avoidance of hell or because of the promises he has for us?

...."in my father's house are many mansions"....this makes me happy, gives me purpose and fulfills my deepest longings!!! I've seen enough suffering on this side of eternity and have hope for a better place of eternal fellowship and relationship and community!!!

No, Prax...this entire discussion I've had was not based on the original post regarding Comfort....it was from Keith's comment about fallacy....that is where this entire debate stemmed from. You apparently missed the point of everything I've been saying...

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by J-Roc

No, Prax...this entire discussion I've had was not based on the original post regarding Comfort....it was from Keith's comment about fallacy....that is where this entire debate stemmed from. You apparently missed the point of everything I've been saying...

So do you agree we need to preach about sin and the consequence of sin to the lost and not instead preach a message to them that God just wants to make their flight a better one?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by J-Roc

No, Prax...this entire discussion I've had was not based on the original post regarding Comfort....it was from Keith's comment about fallacy....that is where this entire debate stemmed from. You apparently missed the point of everything I've been saying...

You quote K4H

Also it exposes the fallacy of the doctrine that come to Jesus because he will make you happy,give you purpose, fullfill your deepest longings, etc., instead he will save you from your sins.

Uh....yes isn't this what I HAVE been talking about? What we preach to the LOST? The reason we give to them to COME to Jesus in the first place?

This is EXACTLY what I have been talking about. We are discussing HOW to reach the lost...HOW to convert them...not post conversion. True and False conversion. That seems to be exactly what Keith is speaking about here.

What do we preach to uncoverted to LEAD them to Jesus...not what do we preach to the converted who have already been LED to Jesus...that seems to be what this discussion was about and what Keith was saying there

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

You quote K4H

Also it exposes the fallacy of the doctrine that come to Jesus because he will make you happy,give you purpose, fullfill your deepest longings, etc., instead he will save you from your sins.

Uh....yes isn't this what I HAVE been talking about? What we preach to the LOST? The reason we give to them to COME to Jesus in the first place?

This is EXACTLY what I have been talking about. We are discussing HOW to reach the lost...HOW to convert them...not post conversion. True and False conversion. That seems to be exactly what Keith is speaking about here.

What do we preach to uncoverted to LEAD them to Jesus...not what do we preach to the converted who have already been LED to Jesus...that seems to be what this discussion was about and what Keith was saying there

If that is what you have been talking about then we are both discussing the same issue and are taking opposite views on the issue...therefore, nobody has lost the point of the discussion!

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by jroc

...."in my father's house are many mansions"....this makes me happy, gives me purpose and fulfills my deepest longings!!! I've seen enough suffering on this side of eternity and have hope for a better place of eternal fellowship and relationship and community!!!

Yes this makes YOU happy....you are converted. These are edifying words to the converted. But what Keith is speaking of are the words we speak to the unconverted in order to LEAD them to Christ.

Yes, we can tell them there is eternity to expect, but what the thread is about isn't eternal rewards, but NOW rewards. The fallacy is that we reach them by simply telling them they will be happy, that life will be much better. Just like the flight. It's not the telling them about their possible destination that is the fallacy, it's the telling them that if they turn to Christ He will make your flight just great.

And as any believer knows, this walk since being converted has it's ups and downs.

And when they experience those downs, they feel cheated just like the guy on the flight who is told if he wears this parachute it will make his flight better...when the reality was that the ONLY reason for the parachute was that in the event of trouble he will be secure...the parachute actually was uncomfortable but for the man that is not disappointed by the stories that it will make your flight better, but instead is wearing it because he knows it can save him, he does not mind wearing it.

True and false conversion. True conversion is knowing that Christ died for the ungodly...sinners like you and I and otherwise we were all lost. The fallacy here is not telling them about eternal life...the eternal perks....the fallacy is about NOT telling them WHY they need Jesus...WHY they need to repent and instead focus on TEMPORAL perks...not eternal perks....which is a fallacy