Pastor shot with own gun.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by TJJJ

Turn the other cheek....

Would you defend a female relative being raped in front of you?

[MinisterTruth]

Originally Posted by Originalist

Would you defend a female relative being raped in front of you?

I don't think using hypotheticals are the best forms of arguments, but for the sake of discussion, I'll answer with another hypothetical situation: what if there were 30 men surrounding you with guns in their hands, intending to rape your female relative? Would you carry high-capacity mags, rifles, etc... everywhere you go? Again, this is why I don't care for hypothetical statements in arguments. Please show me examples where the Lord, Jesus Christ encouraged self-defense using swords, staves or any weapons. If we're called Christians, 'followers of Christ', shouldn't this be the ultimate example?

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by MinisterTruth

I don't think using hypotheticals are the best forms of arguments, but for the sake of discussion, I'll answer with another hypothetical situation: what if there were 30 men surrounding you with guns in their hands, intending to rape your female relative? Would you carry high-capacity mags, rifles, etc... everywhere you go? Again, this is why I don't care for hypothetical statements in arguments. Please show me examples where the Lord, Jesus Christ encouraged self-defense using swords, staves or any weapons. If we're called Christians, 'followers of Christ', shouldn't this be the ultimate example?

False dichotomy. Christ does NOT condemn self-defense. I cannot condemn something he does not.

[MinisterTruth]

Originally Posted by Originalist

False dichotomy. Christ does NOT condemn self-defense. I cannot condemn something he does not.

On the contrary, I see where Jesus rebuked Peter for how he used his sword in Matt 26, not for having one; my argument from the beginning. Then tells him to put it up and continues to say, "don't you know that if I prayed to the Father, he'd send more than 12 legions of angels down to help?" This right here sounds like the Lord's weapon of choice, don't you think? He even asks Judas (paraphrasing), "did you have to come out here with weapons, as if you were looking for a thief or criminal?" This to me gives the impression that the Lord never encouraged weapons for self-defense.

[Esaias]

https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/...a-8b5ab3fffbb4

Pastor found the guy hiding in a bathroom stall, drew his gun, ordered him to leave. He was headed out towards the front door when he suddenly turned, attacked the pastor, took his gun, and killed him. Suspect has a gunshot wound in the hand so likely they fought over the gun and it fired while suspect was grabbing on to it.

Lesson? Maintain distance (21 Foot Rule +) and if you draw down on someone do not allow them to walk around. He should have ordered the suspect face down feet crossed hands on back of head, had someone else call police, and waited.

Either that or get an alarm system so he would have known the building had an unauthorized entry prior to him and 3 others wandering on in. The fact the police did not secure and clear the building is a contributing factor to this man's death.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Esaias

https://www.11alive.com/amp/article/...a-8b5ab3fffbb4

Pastor found the guy hiding in a bathroom stall, drew his gun, ordered him to leave. He was headed out towards the front door when he suddenly turned, attacked the pastor, took his gun, and killed him. Suspect has a gunshot wound in the hand so likely they fought over the gun and it fired while suspect was grabbing on to it.

Lesson? Maintain distance (21 Foot Rule +) and if you draw down on someone do not allow them to walk around. He should have ordered the suspect face down feet crossed hands on back of head, had someone else call police, and waited.

Either that or get an alarm system so he would have known the building had an unauthorized entry prior to him and 3 others wandering on in. The fact the police did not secure and clear the building is a contributing factor to this man's death.

Details, not headlines, matter.

[CC1]

Originally Posted by TJJJ

Starville Methodist Pastor shot with his own gun after confronting fugitive.

Hmmmmmm, this is what happens when a so called Christian forgets that the weapons of our warfare are not carnal.....

Sorry but I think you way off base (a polite way of saying things because what I really think of your logic would be too crude for this forum). Any man who would not defend or himself against harm with whatever weapons are available to him is shameful.

Your logic is the kind of logic that says since the bible says God will provide for me I will just sit on my butt and wait for blessings.

I think God expects us to use common sense to defend and protect ourselves and our family.

Your logic reminds me of the old story about the man whose home gets caught in flooding after a hurricane. As the water rose a neighbor who was evacuating in his 4 wheel drive vehicle with large tires offered to give him a ride to safety but the man declined saying "God will take care of me". As the water rose he had to move to the second story of his home at which point a man in a boat came buy and told him to get in. He again declined once again proclaiming that God would take care of him.

The water rose even higher and he eventually moved to his roof top. A rescue helicoper saw him there and hovered overhead and lowered a rescue worker to hoist him aboard. Once again he declined telling the rescuers that God would take care of him.

The water eventually completely covered the home and the man drowned. When he got to heaven he said to the Lord " I don't understand! I had faith that you would take care of me but you didn't. You let me die!" To which the Lord replied "What are you talking about? I sent a 4 wheel drive truck, a boat, and a helicopter to save you!".

[Esaias]

Suppose a Christian man defended his church assembly with a firearm, and blew away several ruffians and caused the rest of their bushwacking gang to flee? Now, could you imagine an apostolic preacher preaching a sermon, and saying "Look at brother Rambo, how he blew those bad guys away and made the rest of their gang run off like the yellow dog cowards they were"? Could you imagine the scandal? Why, that preacher couldn't possibly have the Holy Ghost, right?

But notice what the apostle Paul said, when teaching about faith in God:

And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets: Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions, Quenched the violence of fire, escaped the edge of the sword, out of weakness were made strong, waxed valiant in fight, turned to flight the armies of the aliens.
(Heb 11:32-34)

An apostolic preacher, an apostle no less, praising the military prowess and lethal accomplishments of people as examples of FAITH...

Folks, make sure your religious views line up with the religious views of the prophets and apostles of Jesus Christ. EVERYTHING hangs on that alignment.

[seguidordejesus]

Good enough for them, good enough for me.

[TJJJ]

Originally Posted by seguidordejesus

Good enough for them, good enough for me.

Love it!