How do you 'pastor' somebody?

[Esaias]

Hearing a lot of talk about 'pastoring' people.

So... for all you pastors...how do you 'pastor' somebody?

Specifically, what is involved?

[Steve Epley]

First comes the call and burden.
Your burden is to pray for their spiritual well being and seek God for messages that will perfect-encourage-and bless them.
You watch for their souls to lead-admonish-and yes sometimes to reprove and rebuke them to keep them in the narrow path.
You are grieved when you see them making wrong decisions that will affect adversely themselves and their families.
God has placed you in their lives to feed them which means to care for them. Simple but there it is.

[Esaias]

Here is a good bible study of the subject of 'pastors'.

http://www.bibleanswerstand.org/pastors.htm

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Here is a good bible study of the subject of 'pastors'.

http://www.bibleanswerstand.org/pastors.htm

That looks like a good study, but isn't it more interesting to read replies from the pastors on this board? I think you learn a lot more when you listen to people speak from their hearts. One person's perspective on what should comprise pastoring is going to have subjective value, depending on the already established views of the reader.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

That looks like a good study, but isn't it more interesting to read replies from the pastors on this board? I think you learn a lot more when you listen to people speak from their hearts. One person's perspective on what should comprise pastoring is going to have subjective value, depending on the already established views of the reader.

The problem is most 'pastors' on this board do not seem to match the biblical definition of 'pastor', in that most pastors on this board believe in and support the 'one man, one church' sole pastorship model rather than the biblical model.

As a result, their views as to what a pastor's job is, will likely be biased towards the particular model they are part of.

Brother Epley's response demonstrates his concern for the spiritual well-being of the people who look to him as their shepherd. However, I can't help but think that brother Epley has limited himself because of his views on the nature of eldership, oversight, church structure, etc.

My personal experience has been that 'pastors' generally are focused on two things - Doing good sermons, and making sure everybody in the church is paying tithes and not rocking the boat. The pastor has 'the vision' for the church, everybody else is a helpmate to achieve his vision. Anyone who has a different 'vision' is invited to find another church (or worse...). I have personally known pastors who are wonderful Christians, and others who seem to be nothing more than hired help, managers running a business, but I have never seen a church functioning Biblically, with a plurality of elders having the oversight and teaching house to house (ie spending time with each family or household teaching them sound doctrine).

As someone pointed out on the other thread... 'who pastors the pastor?'

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The problem is most 'pastors' on this board do not seem to match the biblical definition of 'pastor', in that most pastors on this board believe in and support the 'one man, one church' sole pastorship model rather than the biblical model.

As a result, their views as to what a pastor's job is, will likely be biased towards the particular model they are part of.

Brother Epley's response demonstrates his concern for the spiritual well-being of the people who look to him as their shepherd. However, I can't help but think that brother Epley has limited himself because of his views on the nature of eldership, oversight, church structure, etc.

My personal experience has been that 'pastors' generally are focused on two things - Doing good sermons, and making sure everybody in the church is paying tithes and not rocking the boat. The pastor has 'the vision' for the church, everybody else is a helpmate to achieve his vision. Anyone who has a different 'vision' is invited to find another church (or worse...). I have personally known pastors who are wonderful Christians, and others who seem to be nothing more than hired help, managers running a business, but I have never seen a church functioning Biblically, with a plurality of elders having the oversight and teaching house to house (ie spending time with each family or household teaching them sound doctrine).

As someone pointed out on the other thread... 'who pastors the pastor?'

[Often unattainable] Ideals aside, I believe most pastors have good hearts and are in it for the right reasons. Even if the system is messed up, that doesn't mean they aren't doing God's work as best as they can and as best as they know how to do it. That also doesn't mean that God isn't in it and they aren't still His messengers.

Systemic changes often take decades or even centuries to accomplish. In the meantime, people have to work within the structure they've been handed. You have to work for change while you're still working with what you have.

There are some men who are no doubt in the pastoring field for the money and maybe even some perceived glamour, but that isn't the majority. It can't be, because most pastoring positions are markedly unglamorous and don't offer much in the way of monetary gain.

Regarding money...just a thought: My Dad struggled and got frustrated with people who didn't give tithes and offerings--not because HE wanted the money, but because there were church bills that had to be paid. When there wasn't enough money in the church coffers, he paid the bills out of his personal accounts, and often put tithes money right back into the church to cover mortgage payments, utilities, etc. Asking for money isn't always a sign of personal greed. In fact, IMO, it's unbiblical for a pastor to NEED to ask for money. If a local church was operating biblically, the saints would be dividing up the bills among themselves and paying for them. (Sharing things equally.) That load was never intended to be on the pastor alone.

[DaveC519]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The problem is most 'pastors' on this board do not seem to match the biblical definition of 'pastor', in that most pastors on this board believe in and support the 'one man, one church' sole pastorship model rather than the biblical model.

My friend, the monarchical episcopate IS the biblical model. It is widely recognized that James the Lord's brother was the episcopos of Jerusalem, and that this existed from the beginning. In the churches Paul and his companions founded, a "committee" type of pastorship model existed. But these, too, later evolved into the single pastor model, as evidenced by Timothy and Titus' ministry.

As a result, their views as to what a pastor's job is, will likely be biased towards the particular model they are part of.

Or rather, their views could be "biased" towards the biblical model (see above). You are "poisoning the well" with loaded terms.

Brother Epley's response demonstrates his concern for the spiritual well-being of the people who look to him as their shepherd. However, I can't help but think that brother Epley has limited himself because of his views on the nature of eldership, oversight, church structure, etc.

This is nothing more than your own personal opinion.

"Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand." (Rom 14:4)

My personal experience has been

And now we get to the heart of the matter. Your "personal experience" has clouded an objective assessment and discussion of biblical "pastoring". But an exegesis of the Scriptures does not, and cannot, include subjectivism. We must draw conclusion solely on what's in the Word, not on what our "experience" has been.

that 'pastors' generally are focused on two things - Doing good sermons, and making sure everybody in the church is paying tithes and not rocking the boat.

And here's what Paul had to say about that to the episcopos of Ephesus:

"Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry." (2 Tim 4:2-5)

The pastor has 'the vision' for the church, everybody else is a helpmate to achieve his vision. Anyone who has a different 'vision' is invited to find another church (or worse...).

Solomon said where there is no "vision" (singular), the people perish (Pr 29:18). Paul admonished the churches to be in unity (1 Cor 1:10; Eph 4:3, etc.). Since it is God who sets up shepherds over his own flock (Jer. 3:15; 23:4), exactly whose "vision" should the flock have? Obviously, if God appoints and anoints the shepherds, and leads them to lead his flock (1 Pet 5:2), then the Pastor would receive the vision, and the flock would share in that vision.

I have personally known pastors who are wonderful Christians, and others who seem to be nothing more than hired help, managers running a business

Again, personal experience does not equal objective exegesis. It is unfortunate that you have had bad experiences with pastors and/or churches, and I pray God grant you healing in your hurt.

but I have never seen a church functioning Biblically, with a plurality of elders having the oversight and teaching house to house (ie spending time with each family or household teaching them sound doctrine).

Your assessment is incorrect (see above).

As someone pointed out on the other thread... 'who pastors the pastor?'

That would be God himself. And make no mistake, it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living God (Heb 10:31). As we see from Christ's letters to the seven churches of Asia, when the church itself is rebuked for its conduct, it is each church's pastor ("angels": Gr angelos = "messenger", ie- pastor) who is called on the carpet for it.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

First comes the call and burden.
Your burden is to pray for their spiritual well being and seek God for messages that will perfect-encourage-and bless them.
You watch for their souls to lead-admonish-and yes sometimes to reprove and rebuke them to keep them in the narrow path.
You are grieved when you see them making wrong decisions that will affect adversely themselves and their families.
God has placed you in their lives to feed them which means to care for them. Simple but there it is.

Spoken like a man with a pastor's heart--my Dad would have given a similar answer. I believe that most pastors feel this way. The bad apples are a lot fewer and farther between than people might think.

[phareztamar]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

First comes the call and burden.
Your burden is to pray for their spiritual well being and seek God for messages that will perfect-encourage-and bless them.
You watch for their souls to lead-admonish-and yes sometimes to reprove and rebuke them to keep them in the narrow path.
You are grieved when you see them making wrong decisions that will affect adversely themselves and their families.
God has placed you in their lives to feed them which means to care for them. Simple but there it is.

Amen pastor.

[tv1a]

I teach people and let them fly. Not a good legalists methodology.