Apostolic But Not Believing Jesus is The Father?

[Jermyn Davidson]

Remind me, please.

How does Oneness Theology work for those who really are Oneness but really don't believe that Jesus Christ is the Father (as in God the Father).

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Remind me, please.

How does Oneness Theology work for those who really are Oneness but really don't believe that Jesus Christ is the Father (as in God the Father).

Categories of belief have to have meaning, or else they cease to be categories.

I would say that if a person claims to be Oneness, but doesn't believe that Jesus is the Father, then they cannot be classified as "Oneness".

We shouldn't go around co-opting terms to suit ourselves when the terms have an already well established meaning.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Categories of belief have to have meaning, or else they cease to be categories.

I would say that if a person claims to be Oneness, but doesn't believe that Jesus is the Father, then they cannot be classified as "Oneness".

We shouldn't go around co-opting terms to suit ourselves when the terms have an already well established meaning.

Exactly. No one is in "Apostolic Oneness" who rejects that Christ is both the Father and the Son.

This is a unique faith in the world and as to this particular truth the more Biblical.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Remind me, please.

How does Oneness Theology work for those who really are Oneness but really don't believe that Jesus Christ is the Father (as in God the Father).

If you dont figure out the Godhead, it can affect your faith inadvertently. You might want to read the download of David Bernard on "The Oneness of God".....https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...77880786,d.cWc

I started in the foundation of his type of oneness teaching and vary just slightly in a couple of areas. But Bernards stuff will help you understand and be at peace with the subject.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Remind me, please.

How does Oneness Theology work for those who really are Oneness but really don't believe that Jesus Christ is the Father (as in God the Father).

There are groups that believe in only one God besides Oneness Pentecostals. However they also reject the fact that Christ is God...not just the Father period.

Jehovah Witnesses a prime example.

If Jesus is not the Father he is not the Christ. The Christ must be both according to Isaiahs Messianic prophecy of Isaiah 9:6.

[elder_brother]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Exactly. No one is in "Apostolic Oneness" who rejects that Christ is both the Father and the Son.

This is a unique faith in the world and as to this particular truth the more Biblical.

I'm just wondering, from this perspective does any real distinction exist between the Father & the Son? Furthermore, if Jesus Christ is both Father & Son then does a Father and a Son really exist?

Would you be able to affirm that both the Father and the Son are of One divine essence?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by elder_brother

I'm just wondering, from this perspective does any real distinction exist between the Father & the Son? Furthermore, if Jesus Christ is both Father & Son then does a Father and a Son really exist?

Would you be able to affirm that both the Father and the Son are of One divine essence?

Scripture does not say one divine essence. It does say this concerning the Messiah:

Isaiah 9:6

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of peace.

I affirm the Messiah (YESHUA) is the begotten son and the Eternal Father? Do you?

The distiction is that the son was born of a woman. Therefore a human being. The Father is the Mighty God of Heaven.

Yeshua is both simultaneously. He is God and man at the same time.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Remind me, please.

How does Oneness Theology work for those who really are Oneness but really don't believe that Jesus Christ is the Father (as in God the Father).

My understanding might be close to what you're talking about. I had explained my understanding in a previous post which I will share here. Please let me know if this helps. God bless you and yours.

Originally Posted by Aquila

The man, Jesus Christ, was indeed a man. A human being. Yet He was also God. How? Oneness. He was one with the Father.

Let's review how Jesus Himself describes His Oneness with the Father...

John 10:30
30 I and my Father are one. (KJV)

John 10:38
38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. (KJV)

John 12:45
45 And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me. (KJV)

John 14:7-10
7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
8 Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. (KJV)

If you walked the earth with Jesus, you'd get to know Him as a man. He'd teach. He'd laugh. He'd eat. He'd use the restroom. He'd sleep. He'd rest. He'd pray and speak of His Heavenly Father. He'd fast. He'd cry. He'd sweat. He'd bleed. However... at times you'd feel something otherworldly emanating from deep within Him. Something emanating from the very core of His being. Something powerful. Something that has authority over all creation. Something that speaks to the winds... bringing them into obedience. Something that raises the dead and heals all manner of sickness. Something indescribable. You'd sense GOD Himself at the core of Christ's own person. You'd realize that this man is... also God.

However, keep in mind...God did not reside in Christ as a vehicle. God resided in and permeated Christ's very being. A Oneness so complete, so majestic, and so divine that in Christ it can be said that God became a man... and that this very same man was also God.

No other religion elevates Christ to such an infinite height of majesty and honor. No other religion expresses Christ's true person to such an infinite degree. Most religions merely make Christ a prophet. No... Christ was not just a prophet. Christ was the human tabernacle of God Himself. To deny this imperils the soul... and reduces Christ to being either a lunatic or a liar.

All authority and power has been delivered to Christ Jesus. He will judge Krishna. He will judge Buddha. He will judge Mohammed. He will judge Nanak. He will judge the followers of every false prophet and madman. He will judge all men in accordance to the Father's will as it relates to the Gospel. Through Him, the Father will judge. Because they are one.

[Sean]

The way Jesus and the Father are one is because Jesus had the Holy Ghost(Spirit of the Father) inside him.

The way we are one with Jesus, other than baptism, is when we have the Holy Ghost in us(Spirit of Christ).

[Jermyn Davidson]

THIS

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Exactly. No one is in "Apostolic Oneness" who rejects that Christ is both the Father and the Son.

This is a unique faith in the world and as to this particular truth the more Biblical.

IS DIFFERENT FROM THIS.

Originally Posted by Sean

The way Jesus and the Father are one is because Jesus had the Holy Ghost(Spirit of the Father) inside him.

The way we are one with Jesus, other than baptism, is when we have the Holy Ghost in us(Spirit of Christ).

Care to explain?