Why I Am A Futurist

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by mfblume

And in regards to knowing prophecy, you can certainly believe and adhere to what you want. But I think it's a traditional error that we cannot perfectly know prophecy. And I do not demand you believe I got revelation from God about it. I really don't care who believes I did. The important thing for me is that I know I did. Each person needs to be fully persuaded for themselves. I don't look at everyone claiming to have a revelation to determine the odds of me actually getting one from God, any more than I look at every religion claiming to be from God in order to determine which one is right. God doesn't want us to be concerned that way. God made this a personal issue. So, I am unable to prove anything to you. He wants it that way because it's called faith.

Some look at all religions and throw their hands up in the air saying there's no hope of finding truth. But such a concept forgets that there is a God who can do with YOU whatever you have faith for Him to do. Who cares about everyone else? When it comes to us and God only we ourselves matter when it comes to knowing for sure what we know.

That's not disparaging reaching to others for their salvation. That's a whole other ball of wax altogether. Unrelated.

So, I don;t mind what you think of my doctrine. I know what I experienced. And let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

I don't even care what doctrine you believe. Matters nothing to me. But for those who ask what I believe, I will tell them quite passionately. But in no way is that demanding anyone to agree with me.

I hope I am not being offensive because it is not my intention. I enjoy hearing people's thoughts and enjoyed the teaching you posted and probably will watch more. I am a young 33 yr. old pastor who I am still developing in some of my doctrinal stances. The new birth is something I firmly stand on and the black and white issue in the word of God but I am still developing in other areas and like to hear what people say from every side of the spectrum.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

I hope I am not being offensive because it is not my intention. I enjoy hearing people's thoughts and enjoyed the teaching you posted and probably will watch more. I am a young 33 yr. old pastor who I am still developing in some of my doctrinal stances. The new birth is something I firmly stand on and the black and white issue in the word of God but I am still developing in other areas and like to hear what people say from every side of the spectrum.

You are not offensive in any sense of the term. I enjoy sharing and discussing like this. And I appreciate your willingness to discuss. You can take whatever you want from my beliefs and do with them as you wish. I'm just answering to the best of my sincerest abilities.

[good samaritan]

Where were all the OT saints while awaiting Jesus death, burial, and resurrection? Some teach they went to hell where Jesus went and got them, but I feel like that is one's definition of hell. If hell is death and the grave yes, but I don't believe that Abraham was ever in fiery pit of torment. If not hell then would you say the kingdom of heaven?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Where were all the OT saints while awaiting Jesus death, burial, and resurrection? Some teach they went to hell where Jesus went and got them, but I feel like that is one's definition of hell. If hell is death and the grave yes, but I don't believe that Abraham was ever in fiery pit of torment. If not hell then would you say the kingdom of heaven?

They were in what Christ called Abraham's bosom. Not in heaven but in the place of non-torment where the obedient dead went.

Sheol in before the cross had, as it were, two compartments. One of fiery torment, called Gehenna, and the other of peaceful waiting called Abraham's bosom. Since the cross the abode of the righteous dead was removed and sheol now holds only gehenna.

That's why Christ's resurrection saw many of the saints walking the city. He removed them from there and took them on up into glory for the first time.

My belief, anyway.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by mfblume

They were in what Christ called Abraham's bosom. Not in heaven but in the place of non-torment where the obedient dead went.

Sheol in before the cross had, as it were, two compartments. One of fiery torment, called Gehenna, and the other of peaceful waiting called Abraham's bosom. Since the cross the abode of the righteous dead was removed and sheol now holds only gehenna.

That's why Christ's resurrection saw many of the saints walking the city. He removed them from there and took them on up into glory for the first time.

My belief, anyway.

With that in mind. Scriptures teach that the dead in Christ shall rise first. So would you say that when we die we go straight to heaven? On judgement day when we the Lord returns He will come with all the saints that have gone on before and receive all those that are alive and remain and at that time also judge the devil, his angels and the lost of this world?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

With that in mind. Scriptures teach that the dead in Christ shall rise first. So would you say that when we die we go straight to heaven?

Yes.

Our souls and spirits leave our bodies.

That's why Paul made this statement.

2 Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

And when the resurrection takes place, our bodies are once again provided for us and are then made immortal and incorruptible, though.

On judgement day when we the Lord returns He will come with all the saints that have gone on before and receive all those that are alive and remain and at that time also judge the devil, his angels and the lost of this world?

Yes! No millennium after and no time on earth for sinners in any way, either. We go straight to the white throne judgment. Everyone. Satan and demons and sinners alike.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Yes.

Our souls and spirits leave our bodies.

That's why Paul made this statement.

2 Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

And when the resurrection takes place, our bodies are once again provided for us and are then made immortal and incorruptible, though.


Yes! No millennium after and no time on earth for sinners in any way, either. We go straight to the white throne judgment. Everyone. Satan and demons and sinners alike.

To me this is very plausible. It makes sense and shouldn't be offensive
to anyone's rapture point of view. Many people's pre-trib view makes it sound like Jesus makes two trips once for the rapture and then another for the battle of Armageddon and the judgement. That never fit well with me, but really the only thing I am sure of is the resurrection to eternal life or death.

[Michael The Disciple]

I cant remember any Christian type groups our ministries who were clueless about how the Church is the kingdom of God in this present time.

Most understand that what we experience now we experience entirely by faith. It is a present reality but obviously there is coming a time when Jesus Christ will in all actuality establish a kingdom on this Earth.

Peter saw it coming in the future.

2 Peter 1:5-11

5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; 6And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; 7And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. 8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. 10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

So those who are abiding in the kingdom now (by faith) were told if they make their calling and election sure will be granted entrance INTO THE HEAVENLY KINGDOM OF THE LORD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST.

[Esaias]

Not to mention Paul taught flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom thus we have to translated.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I cant remember any Christian type groups our ministries who were clueless about how the Church is the kingdom of God in this present time.

Most understand that what we experience now we experience entirely by faith. It is a present reality but obviously there is coming a time when Jesus Christ will in all actuality establish a kingdom on this Earth.

Peter saw it coming in the future.

2 Peter 1:5-11

5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; 6And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; 7And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. 8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. 10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 11For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

So those who are abiding in the kingdom now (by faith) were told if they make their calling and election sure will be granted entrance INTO THE HEAVENLY KINGDOM OF THE LORD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST.

How can Jesus day the kingdom doesn't come with observation if it will be physical on the earth? He said you can't point in any direction and say it is there. That's because it'll never be physical.