The Persecution of Women in the Church

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

Sadly the RCC controls the minds and thoughts of many Apostolics...they are fast to tell you when the mode of baptism was changed and who changed it...but they do not tell you who took the women from behind the pulpits...

AHA! FINALLY SOMEONE WHO AGREES! Growing up in a church culture where many RCC converts came from Mexico, I have no doubt this oppresive spirit and denegrating mindset had deep roots...all the way back to the garden.

[Sister Alvear]

Long before Jesus’ time, discrimination of the women began during the Babylonian captivity or shortly afterward when the Jews returned from the dispersion under Persian King, Cyrus. The decline of women in Israel was always due to the invasion of heathen influence.
Or according to the book of Josephus, women cannot be witnesses. By the 3rd century women were usually barred from the priesthood. By the 4th century, the female deacon (deaconess) had been removed from God’s service all together. (See Council of Orange)

[Sister Alvear]

The language of an edict of the Council of Orange in 441 AD indicates that as late as the 5th century even deaconesses were still considered clerics.
Even though there was a vehement struggle of the woman in God’s service some sources show an overwhelming impression that the first generation Christians endeavored to put into effect the gender equality practiced by Jesus.



Voices from History

The radical change that happened during Constantine’s reign when Christianity became the official religion of Rome meant that Roman culture and pagan concepts would be mixed with pure Christianity. Thus they would try to ban the use of women through their pagan ideas once again.

Secular history supports the fact that women were preachers. Oregenes talks about it in his writing that the women went to far away areas carrying the gospel.

CHRYSOSTOM of the fourth century wrote "the women of those days were more spirited than lions, sharing with the Apostles their labors for the Gospel’s sake. In this way they traveled with them and performed small ministries such as supplying the material needs of their brethren, as well as, participating in missionary work" (See Chrysostom & Theodore).

IRENAEUS, acknowledged the Gifts of the Spirits were liberally bestowed on all ranks of the faithful on women as on elders, on boys as well as on bishops.

DOWELL, in Dissections of Irenaeus says, “the gift of the spirit of prophecy was given to them besides the Apostles: and that not only in the first, second, but in the third century even to the time of Constantine men had these gifts; yea, and women too."

TERTULLIAN, one of the oldest historians was quoted in an article, The Indian Standard (a Presbyterian magazine in India): AIn the Catacombs are found representations of women clergy and they are shown presiding at the Lord’s Supper...."

TERTULLIAN, was in intolerant of women, but he acknowledged that "Holy Priscilla had preached the
Gospel." Tertullian disliked Christian women doing visitation work saying, "What heathen will suffer his wife to go about from one street to another to the houses of strangers, to the meanest hovels, indeed, to visit the heathen? What heathen will allow her to steal away to the dungeon to kiss the chain of the martyr?"

Tertullian went as far as to deny the authenticity of a baptism performed by a woman. This seems to prove that the practice of baptism performed by women was happening in his day. But this early church father came to recognize that even a woman, if she “spoke with the Spirit” had more authority in then that of the greatest bishop. He represented an empty office compared to a woman who represented the Spirit.

[Sister Alvear]

An interesting scripture is Nehemiah 6:7: "Thou hast appointed prophets to preach." Though some have said that prophets prophesy and preachers preach, but this proves that prophets or prophetesses preach. Jonah 3:2: "Arise, go to Ninevah, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I lead thee." No wonder the Bible teaches that to believe we must have a preacher to preach (Romans 10:14-15).

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

An interesting scripture is Nehemiah 6:7: "Thou hast appointed prophets to preach." Though some have said that prophets prophesy and preachers preach, but this proves that prophets or prophetesses preach. Jonah 3:2: "Arise, go to Ninevah, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I lead thee." No wonder the Bible teaches that to believe we must have a preacher to preach (Romans 10:14-15).

There no dispute over the prophets preaching but did the prophetesses do any preaching that is the verse you need. Let me get my penzil and paper to write that down.

[Sister Alvear]

It was the Pharisees and Sadducees that believed the woman to be inferior. Jesus was different. He did not hesitate to call a woman daughter of Abraham (Luke 13:16).
Jesus broke every tradition, crossed the boundary line and astonished them with His doctrine. Jesus does not condone one human being superior to another. He does not make slaves. He makes those who are enslaved, free!

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

It was the Pharisees and Sadducees that believed the woman to be inferior. Jesus was different. He did not hesitate to call a woman daughter of Abraham (Luke 13:16).
Jesus broke every tradition, crossed the boundary line and astonished them with His doctrine. Jesus does not condone one human being superior to another. He does not make slaves. He makes those who are enslaved, free!

Well said Sister!!

[Sister Alvear]

It is interesting to know that Paul said "help those women that labor with me in the gospel (Philippians 4:3) and said, "That ye submit yourselves unto such, and to everyone that helpeth with us and laboreth. Paul believed that all Christians should be subject to men and women who are leaders in the church.

That worked until the church became interested in titles and positions...

[Felicity]

Many of the other posts and positions had merit too.

I don't think anyone here opposes the idea that women should be treated with the respect and worth God has given to them.

I don't believe any woman haters posted in this thread.

[The Mrs]

Originally Posted by Felicity

Many of the other posts and positions had merit too.

I don't think anyone here opposes the idea that women should be treated with the respect and worth God has given to them.

I don't believe any woman haters posted in this thread.

I was interested in hearing reality...not an idea.

What is our world dealing with today...and why.