Talking bad against ministers - Page 5

Jack Shephard · #1 08-09-2010, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whoami

I think some turn a blind eye because it reinforces the standards, and some actually agree with HMH doctrine.

Yup I agree. Good point.

RandyWayne · #2 08-08-2010, 07:30 PM

This may have been alluded to already but is anyone proclaiming themselves a pastor suddenly "God's Anointed" and worthy of fearful respect?

I mean.... anymore than we should be giving the average stranger we run into?

nannie77662 · #3 08-08-2010, 07:53 PM

We were taught as young children never to speak badly or criticize any minister and I have tried to practice this for 68 years. The scriptures say: "Touch not mine anointed and do my prophets no harm"> I'm not about to judge who is anointed or a prophet. I pray for them and leave the rest to the Lord.

RandyWayne · #4 08-08-2010, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nannie77662

We were taught as young children never to speak badly or criticize any minister and I have tried to practice this for 68 years. The scriptures say: "Touch not mine anointed and do my prophets no harm"> I'm not about to judge who is anointed or a prophet. I pray for them and leave the rest to the Lord.

But, you can also do your best to not support someone through action (or inaction). I hold those "amen!"ing LS to be just as guilty as him or more, especially if they say "I don't personally believe that" in private.

Using LS as an example, it is good to lift him up in prayer, but don't support him with encouragement to keep doing what he is doing, or offerings -that is unless you agree with what he is doing to which it is your right do to this pesky thing called the 1st Amendment.....

Maximilian · #5 08-08-2010, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nannie77662

We were taught as young children never to speak badly or criticize any minister and I have tried to practice this for 68 years. The scriptures say: "Touch not mine anointed and do my prophets no harm"> I'm not about to judge who is anointed or a prophet. I pray for them and leave the rest to the Lord.

The very ministers who taught me this held meetings where they bashed other ministers who didn't agree with them. Sometimes they were "tactful" by not saying names. They'd just say the city and region the person pastors

Sneaky guys aren't they. But they didn't technically say the name! ha

Paul defending himself plenty from critics. I'm not sure he ever claimed the people had no right or weren't justified for their criticism. He spent much time defending himself... this, the Apostle of the Early Church.

mental · #6 08-09-2010, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nannie77662

We were taught as young children never to speak badly or criticize any minister and I have tried to practice this for 68 years. The scriptures say: "Touch not mine anointed and do my prophets no harm"> I'm not about to judge who is anointed or a prophet. I pray for them and leave the rest to the Lord.

You really need to read these scriptures in context. It is really a stretch to apply this passage to the NT ministry.

Sister Alvear · #7 08-08-2010, 09:51 PM

touch not mine anointed is often used out of context....

Maximilian · #8 08-08-2010, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

touch not mine anointed is often used out of context....

Yup. Everytime I've heard it used it was.

missourimary · #9 08-09-2010, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

touch not mine anointed is often used out of context....

(Just using your quote to springboard, Sis A. Totally agree with you.)

"Touch not mine anointed" is actually referring to all the children of Israel, not the ministry. "Do my prophets no harm" may be specific to the prophets, but again wouldn't include every priest or even every prophet who declared himself to be of God... there were many false prophets, and these, in the OT, were to be killed. So they definitely didn't fall under the "do my prophets no harm" law. Quite the opposite, actually.

Quote:

Deut 13:1 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, 2And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them; 3Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him. 5And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

I've bolded enough below to show the context was not referring only to the ministry, but to all the children of Israel.

Quote:

1 Chr 16:7Then on that day David delivered first this psalm to thank the LORD into the hand of Asaph and his brethren. 8Give thanks unto the LORD, call upon his name, make known his deeds among the people. 9Sing unto him, sing psalms unto him, talk ye of all his wondrous works. 10Glory ye in his holy name: let the heart of them rejoice that seek the LORD. 11Seek the LORD and his strength, seek his face continually. 12Remember his marvellous works that he hath done, his wonders, and the judgments of his mouth; 13O ye seed of Israel his servant, ye children of Jacob, his chosen ones. 14He is the LORD our God; his judgments are in all the earth. 15Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations; 16Even of the covenant which he made with Abraham, and of his oath unto Isaac; 17And hath confirmed the same to Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant, 18Saying, Unto thee will I give the land of Canaan, the lot of your inheritance; 19When ye were but few, even a few, and strangers in it. 20And when they went from nation to nation, and from one kingdom to another people; 21He suffered no man to do them wrong: yea, he reproved kings for their sakes, 22Saying, Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm. 23Sing unto the LORD, all the earth; shew forth from day to day his salvation. 24Declare his glory among the heathen; his marvellous works among all nations. 25For great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised: he also is to be feared above all gods. 26For all the gods of the people are idols: but the LORD made the heavens. 27Glory and honour are in his presence; strength and gladness are in his place. 28Give unto the LORD, ye kindreds of the people, give unto the LORD glory and strength. 29Give unto the LORD the glory due unto his name: bring an offering, and come before him: worship the LORD in the beauty of holiness. 30Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved. 31Let the heavens be glad, and let the earth rejoice: and let men say among the nations, The LORD reigneth. 32Let the sea roar, and the fulness thereof: let the fields rejoice, and all that is therein. 33Then shall the trees of the wood sing out at the presence of the LORD, because he cometh to judge the earth. 34O give thanks unto the LORD; for he is good; for his mercy endureth for ever. 35And say ye, Save us, O God of our salvation, and gather us together, and deliver us from the heathen, that we may give thanks to thy holy name, and glory in thy praise. 36Blessed be the LORD God of Israel for ever and ever. And all the people said, Amen, and praised the LORD.

Still, I do disagree with naming certain people in most situations. With HMH, the list should be much longer than just two people. If it weren't perpetuated in local churches and districts, (or if the whole idea of uncut hair weren't faulty in itself), the false doctrine of HMH wouldn't stick. However, I was glad to know what well known person had taught it... as soon as the name was stated I remembered when I heard him teach it over 15 years ago. Without that memory, I would have doubted that the stories that people were preaching HMH were true.

mental · #10 08-09-2010, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by missourimary

"Touch not mine anointed" is actually referring to all the children of Israel, not the ministry.

Not only is it talking about all the children of Israel, but God is talking to the heathen Kings surrounding Israel. Unless you want to compare the body of Christ to heathen nations, this scripture has absolutely nothing to do with the Church.