Obama For Mosque at Ground Zero

[Maximilian]

Originally Posted by pelathais

This particular "Iman" came out right after 9/11 and said that the attacks were the work of "the Jews." He said that there was "no way" Muslims could have done this. Later, he said it was all the fault of the United States.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/i...asp?indid=2462

9/11 is to blamed on "the Jews." When that doesn't work, he blames it on the United States. And now, the State Department pays for this guy's to airline tickets to raise money in the Islamic world to build center for the conversion of the American people to Islam.

http://stopthe911mosque.com/2010/08/...t-ground-zero/

http://exposingliberallies.blogspot....-our-dime.html

And the thing about Muslim "clergy" - they all pretty much are educated on the same level as Lee Stoneking's "doctorates" and "adjutant faculty" nonsense. To be an "Iman" all one has to do is to declare themselves to be an "Iman."

If someone in the Islamic world with the moral stature of a King Abdulla II of Jordan were to back some sort of "Muslim cultural center" in Manhattan, I might even visit the place and respectfully review its exhibits.

But when an apologist of terrorists like Iman Rauf uses US taxpayer dollars to pay for his fundraising trips for this "mosque," I'm a bit concerned.

And Baron, help me out here... The First Amendment applies to and protects those citizens of the United States who choose to seek after spiritual and religious ends. Right?

Does the First Amendment apply to foreign governments and foreign NGO's who want to build outreach centers for proselytizing? Isn't this all just another example of government getting too involved in religion?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by DAII

Oh boy .... Muslim invasion ... instead of the Christian theocracy some propose ... oh joy.

We can appeal to extremists on both sides but resorting to conspiratorial rhetoric while acting like our Constitution can be pimped for our own agendas ... while trampled when it suits us ... makes this type of thinking just as Sharia-like ...

Liberty is being test by extremists on both sides ...

Close family friends have recently arrived on these shores escaping Muslim persecution in Aceh Province, Indonesia. They are the source of a lot of my anecdotal "conspiracy notions."

They tell me people are being raped and murdered. I read about similar incidents in the news (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_In...hristian_girls).

You dismiss this carnage as being something formed by my own imagination?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by DAII

Um ... maybe you know more than the mayor of New York City and the who too is sworn to enforce local laws of a city you know nothing about ...and LANDMARKS PRESERVATION COMMISSION who has decided on zoning at least from a historical landmarks perspective ... can you point to the zoning laws and gov't regulation you'd use to suppress liberty???? ....

http://www.nyc.gov/portal/site/nycgo...&rc=1194&ndi=1

That their are fear mongerers who would appeal to polls, mob rule and what other countries is another story.

I love when conseva-kooks appeal to government regulation ....

Dan still drinking his own Koolaid so much that he can't read what I even said. I said

Apparently there are no local laws that prevent them building the mosque, but due to zoning laws Im sure there is a reason BP can't planht a fuel tank farm, whatever that is

Hmmm...Yep another koolaid induced rant by our beloved Dan

Let's repeat that again...there are no local laws that prevent them building the mosque....did you see it that time Mr Koolaid?

[Maximilian]

Originally Posted by pelathais

You rose colored glasses guys are about to see just how Islam has been so successful in spreading its grip on humanity.

1. Infiltration and Taqiyya (deceit)

2. Imposition of Sharia - at first "just for Muslims" - then forced upon everyone else

3. Replacement of Christian/Jewish/Hindu/Buddhist and other houses of worship with mosques and the prohibition against building new non-Muslim houses of worship and ever prohibiting the repair and maintenance of existing structures

4. The Islamisation of the country and gene pool by forcing young girls into Muslim marriages and government subsidies for Muslims who marry and "convert" a "spouse" to Islam

Indonesia became the largest Muslim country in the world within just a little over 100 years by following these steps. Nigeria has proven a harder nut to crack - but they're half way there already. Sudan required some "ethnic cleansing" - no big deal.

Of course India is the world's largest open wound and has been ever since the Muslim invasion.

How will we fare?

Sounds a little Mark Steyn-ish.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Kuwaiti and Saudi nationals "HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT" to build a mosque in Manhattan?

Please show me where it says that in the US Constitution.

American muslims do.

[DAII]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Dan still drinking his own Koolaid so much that he can't read what I even said. I said

Apparently there are no local laws that prevent them building the mosque, but due to zoning laws Im sure there is a reason BP can't planht a fuel tank farm, whatever that is

Hmmm...Yep another koolaid induced rant by our beloved Dan

Let's repeat that again...there are no local laws that prevent them building the mosque....did you see it that time Mr Koolaid?

Thanks for a moment of lucidness ... but you're still Praxeas ....

[DAII]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Close family friends have recently arrived on these shores escaping Muslim persecution in Aceh Province, Indonesia. They are the source of a lot of my anecdotal "conspiracy notions."

They tell me people are being raped and murdered. I read about similar incidents in the news (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_In...hristian_girls).

You dismiss this carnage as being something formed by my own imagination?

Who is dismissing the carnage ???? ... don't be disingenuous and obfuscate ... there has been carnage by Christians as well even on the continent of Africa .... in the name of Jesus.

More appeals to emotion and someone else's country ...

You think the Constitution doesn't have the armor to withstand another mosque among the thousands in our nation for decades?

This one will institute Sharia law ... gotcha.

I don't do the politics of fear.

[pelathais]

DA2 - I know that you don't really have much experience in multicultural affairs, but here's a pic that sort of captures where I'm coming from.



The woman in the back is a UPC pastor's wife, so out of privacy concerns I've blurred her image. The man playing the guitar is a friend from Indonesia. He is providing the accompaniment for a group of children from Nepal who are singing Christian songs.

These people have travel literally half way around the world to find freedom to worship like this (they are conducting a VBS style meeting in an apartment courtyard).

Why would you support efforts to keep these kids from freely worshiping as they wish?

[DAII]

Originally Posted by pelathais

DA2 - I know that you don't really have much experience in multicultural affairs, but here's a pic that sort of captures where I'm coming from.



The woman in the back is a UPC pastor's wife, so out of privacy concerns I've blurred her image. The man playing the guitar is a friend from Indonesia. He is providing the accompaniment for a group of children from Nepal who are singing Christian songs.

These people have travel literally half way around the world to find freedom to worship like this (they are conducting a VBS style meeting in an apartment courtyard).

Why would you support efforts to keep these kids from freely worshiping as they wish?

Why would you be on the side of the KKK and Christian militiamen who want to purify our nation ethnically and religiously?

Ugh. REALLY PELA????

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by DAII

Who is dismissing the carnage ???? ... don't be disingenuous and obfuscate ... there has been carnage by Christians as well even on the continent of Africa .... in the name of Jesus.

More appeals to emotion and someone else's country ...

You think the Constitution doesn't have the armor to withstand another mosque among the thousands in our nation for decades?

This one will institute Sharia law ... gotcha.

I don't do the politics of fear.

Your extremist rhetoric seems to prevent you from dispassionately discussing this topic. You then project your own emotional turmoil onto those around you with whom you think you have a disagreement.

Your "summation" of my argument is an invention of your own imagination. Try and slow down and listen to what other people are saying.