Perplexed!

[Sherri]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Your earlier post left me with the impression that you wanted to clear something up with Mr. Steinway. Were Bro. Hardwick's youth campers really instructed to make "the sign of the cross" after being "baptized in the titles?"

I don't wish to cast aspersions on Mr. Steinway's account, however these types of things are often said and quite often turn out to have been based upon something that was misunderstood. Like "hair cutting parties" and all of that.

Just anxious to know the truth.

I would not doubt Mr. Steinways' report at all.

[deltaguitar]

Originally Posted by Falla39

[/B]

My late father would say, "What good is orthodoxy if its not TRUTH"!

Lets not forget that there are a lot of holes in pentecostal doctrine. For me to stay pentecostal would mean that I have to either ignore truth or lie to myself.

I am just as concerned as anyone about truth.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Sherri

I would not doubt Mr. Steinways' report at all.

... yeah but... "the sign of the cross?" Bro. Hardwick wouldn't have gone for that. I don't know the current pastor. Could this maybe have been something where some "new guy" in the youth group who wasn't raised around Pentecost was trying to insert some innovation of his own? Or maybe some sort complaint someone had that sort of grew in it's dimensions by the time it reached Steinway's ears?

I'm not questioning Mr. Steinway's veracity. It's just that it sort of hit me like one of those "hair cutting parties" reports. And then when CC1 posted, that only strengthened my skepticism. Could there be more to this than Christ Church, Nashville "has gone Catholic?"

That's all I'm asking. On it's face, this does sort of hurt a bit if it's true. On the other hand, who knows?

[ILG]

Originally Posted by deltaguitar

You make a very valid point. It is one that I heard and feared for many years.

I agree that once we start leaving we usually go way further than we ever thought. If I had known where I would be today I would have never taken the first step away from the apostolic message. God had to lead me one step at a time.

Same here, but I'm pretty happy right where I am at! I can't say I was ever truly happy in the UPC.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Stephanas

Why would it seem strange to anybody that a church with an Anglican pastor would have converts make the sign of the cross?????

That's what everyone was saying about Tom Fudge. That Fudge was even an "Anglican priest." Turns out that the truth of the matter was far, far different.

Scott's "Anglican Mission in America" might really be called "Rwandan" more than "Anglish" (Church of England). They have in fact been condemned by the Archbishop of Canterbury. They are a split from the Episcopals who were deemed too liberal. Despite their claims to being part of the "Anglican communion," when the Archbishop of Canterbury singles you out for condemnation like he did, you probably should be thinking about changing the sign over your door.

[MrsMcD]

Originally Posted by Mr. Steinway

I attend a large ex-UPC church. I found out this week that during our Youth Camp this past summer, our youth were baptized in the "titles" instead of "Jesus name" by the youth leaders! In addition to that, each were told to make the sign of the cross after they came out of the water!

Being born and raised in the Apostolic faith, I am spitting nails! Not only are those youth leaders still in place, I'm not sure they were ever reprimanded!

For the first time in years, I'm contemplating a move. Not sure. Someone has some 'splaining to do!

Interesting...I don't even recall seeing Baptist make the sign of the cross after they came out of the water.

[deltaguitar]

Originally Posted by UnTraditional

Pentecostalism is not sensationalism. Pentecostalism is biblical orthodoxy, not man's orthodoxy, especially Oneness Pentecostalism. Those going into the so called orthodox churches, and I know this from experience, are doing so out of their own desire to walk away from the power of God and His presence, instead seeking for churches that have some form of mental spirituality instead of true faith based churches. When a man walks away from this One God Pentecostal truth, he does so, not because of hurt or other reasons, but does so because of his own personal pride and sin many times. You can walk away from a church fellowship and still have the truth, but to walk away from truth is another story all together.

I have walked away from it all and God has really accomplished a great miracle in my life. I didn't walk away from UPC because of sin or pride. I love the people and the organization and it was with great pain that I left. It was my whole identity. I wanted to be a teacher like my dad until I started examining things for myself I realized I couldn't teach people something that wasn't true.

[deltaguitar]

Originally Posted by pelathais

... yeah but... "the sign of the cross?" Bro. Hardwick wouldn't have gone for that. I don't know the current pastor. Could this maybe have been something where some "new guy" in the youth group who wasn't raised around Pentecost was trying to insert some innovation of his own? Or maybe some sort complaint someone had that sort of grew in it's dimensions by the time it reached Steinway's ears?

I'm not questioning Mr. Steinway's veracity. It's just that it sort of hit me like one of those "hair cutting parties" reports. And then when CC1 posted, that only strengthened my skepticism. Could there be more to this than Christ Church, Nashville "has gone Catholic?"

That's all I'm asking. On it's face, this does sort of hurt a bit if it's true. On the other hand, who knows?

Maybe the church is getting away from it's heritage on purpose. Are they truly a Oneness Pentecostal church anymore?

[Stephanas]

Originally Posted by pelathais

That's what everyone was saying about Tom Fudge. That Fudge was even an "Anglican priest." Turns out that the truth of the matter was far, far different.

Scott's "Anglican Mission in America" might really be called "Rwandan" more than "Anglish" (Church of England). They have in fact been condemned by the Archbishop of Canterbury. They are a split from the Episcopals who were deemed too liberal. Despite their claims to being part of the "Anglican communion," when the Archbishop of Canterbury singles you out for condemnation like he did, you probably should be thinking about changing the sign over your door.

So your contention is that the Anglican Mission in the Americas is not Anglican???

I bet that they'd be surprised to hear that.

The Anglican Mission in the Americas and its associated organizations (hereafter the “Anglican Mission”) exist to glorify God by building an alliance of dynamic worshipping communities in the Americas committed to planting, nurturing, and serving churches in the Anglican tradition. The Anglican Mission is a Missionary Jurisdiction of the Anglican Province of Rwanda and part of the worldwide Anglican Communion.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Sherri

Pastor Phil and Carla DePriest are wonderful people! Your nephew is "safe" there.

They are nice folks.