Mark Johnston Drops from UPCI, Garner Next???

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Jay

I said what I did because I watched him preach with power and fervency. What I saw when I went to his website broke my heart, for it was apparent that he no longer held what he once had. I do not know anything about the interior of his church, nor what it looks like, nor anything about his people, but I can see where he has gone by looking at what he has become. However, I would like to see pictures or something so that I could catch a glimpse of his church services.

As I said, what I saw broke my heart. I have to wonder if he has followed after some of the other patterns the "church" world is setting as well.

Please describe what you saw

[Socialite]

Originally Posted by Jay

I said what I did because I watched him preach with power and fervency. What I saw when I went to his website broke my heart, for it was apparent that he no longer held what he once had. I do not know anything about the interior of his church, nor what it looks like, nor anything about his people, but I can see where he has gone by looking at what he has become. However, I would like to see pictures or something so that I could catch a glimpse of his church services.

As I said, what I saw broke my heart. I have to wonder if he has followed after some of the other patterns the "church" world is setting as well.

Was it his beard? His wife's attire? Because those things are soooooo telling

I jest. But I can't be sure who the "church world" is that you refer to, nor do I know what you saw that concerned you so much.

All that I know of MJ today is great and wonderful things.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Jay

I said what I did because I watched him preach with power and fervency. What I saw when I went to his website broke my heart, for it was apparent that he no longer held what he once had.

Jay, you were criticized when you made this post, but I know what I have seen recently with at least 2 of the preachers mentioned in this thread and the only way to describe it is, "heart breaking".

I am sure I need to check myself, remove the beam from my eyes, and etc, but MAN I am deeply saddened by what I've just seen.


It's not supposed to be this way.

[The Lemon]

Not sure about "Heart Breaking" - maybe a little confused. That said, without sitting down and talking to folks like Mark, and Anthony (to name two who left the Mother ship) - it is in some ways impossible to know exactly why they left and why they changed.

It is easy to pick at them for obvious dropping of certain "standards", but other then that I would think there would have to be some sort of conversation as to intent and motive - not just looking at church websites and drawing conclusions.

Maybe I am missing something??

[Jay]

Originally Posted by The Lemon

Not sure about "Heart Breaking" - maybe a little confused. That said, without sitting down and talking to folks like Mark, and Anthony (to name two who left the Mother ship) - it is in some ways impossible to know exactly why they left and why they changed.

It is easy to pick at them for obvious dropping of certain "standards", but other then that I would think there would have to be some sort of conversation as to intent and motive - not just looking at church websites and drawing conclusions.

Maybe I am missing something??

I do not know about Anthony Trout, but Mark Johnston went into the emergent movement, or was at least very strongly inclined in that direction. Much of his website reminded me of the Christ asking the question, "If the blind lead the blind, shall they not both ende up in the ditch?" He went from discussing the absolute truths of the Word, to talking about how we are are on a journey to discover the truth (as if it were as yet unrevealed). This is, as I understand it, one of the indicators of an emergent preacher.

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Jay, you were criticized when you made this post, but I know what I have seen recently with at least 2 of the preachers mentioned in this thread and the only way to describe it is, "heart breaking".

I am sure I need to check myself, remove the beam from my eyes, and etc, but MAN I am deeply saddened by what I've just seen.


It's not supposed to be this way.

Yup. Don't you just hate it when they stop screaming and waving a microphone around and just simply bring the word of God to people in a normal tone of voice? All of the annointing is just gone.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by CC1

Yup. Don't you just hate it when they stop screaming and waving a microphone around and just simply bring the word of God to people in a normal tone of voice? All of the annointing is just gone.

We are brothers in Christ, but we are not on the same page here.

More to it than screaming.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Jay, you were criticized when you made this post, but I know what I have seen recently with at least 2 of the preachers mentioned in this thread and the only way to describe it is, "heart breaking".

I am sure I need to check myself, remove the beam from my eyes, and etc, but MAN I am deeply saddened by what I've just seen.


It's not supposed to be this way.

Wow, I posted that so long ago that I had to rethink what I was saying. Yes, I took some heat for it, but I have recently found the messages that he preached at the Illionois Youth Camp, and I still found myself heartbroken over him.

[Jay]

I do not know anything about his wife and her manner of clothing and/or adorning herself. But when I studied the website, I saw nothing that advocated any form of doctrine; there was little or nothing of substance in the way of a statement of faith or belief. Further, I have been wrestling with the topic of beards and mustaches, but I did not feel that his helped to mark him as being separate from the world or the things therein. Further, I heard no passion or caring in his voice. I felt as if I were watching another cookie cutter mega-church style pastor. The type that will say only good things and not name a single sin, whose churches fill, but whose people never leave behind most of their sins.

I also looked at his blog area, and never once did I see anything that spoke of the amazing transformational power of the Holy Ghost or the Name of Jesus. I saw nothing that would ever mark him as being anything more than a Rick Warren style minister.

He spoke of joining him upon a journey, but he never truly said as to where nor what the ultimate goal of the journey was. Many are the people who journey on this road, but only a few people are going to make it to Heaven which is to be the final goal.

I have written none of these things to be harsh and mean spirited, and I hope that I have not come across so. I remember him as a man who while preaching had a passion and fire for the things of God. I see him again preaching with eyes that would flash under the power of God. You would feel as if he knew exactly where you were, and had a message straight from Heaven itself. It is this that I no longer see.

Not all preachers have that, but I thank God for all of them in their sundry gifts. If I remember correctly, it was after his message in 2007 that God explicitly told me what it was that he wanted me to do and made His will known to me.

These are the things that I no longer perceived, and if that is not what you want, I understand. But it will be those very things that I shall mourn now as lost from among the people.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Jay

Further, I have been wrestling with the topic of beards and mustaches, but I did not feel that his helped to mark him as being separate from the world or the things therein.

I found it to be an erring notion that our appearance and the way we dress is intended by God to mark us as separate from the world. If you think about it, no where in the entire bible is appearance designated to indicate we are distinct from the world. That is a man-made tradition that has somehow become scripture when it is not even in the scripture.

Jesus said our love for one another is what tells the world we are his disciples, not the way we look. To me, it's just like the Roman Catholic Church's emphasis on prayers to Mary to think that the way we dress shows the world who we are. It's not in the bible.