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  #1  
Old 01-18-2016, 07:15 PM
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Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

I suppose this might trigger some negative responses, but I want to make the point that numerical growth is not a sign of revival.

I was part of a church that over the course of ten years, baptized in Jesus name and/or saw infillings of the Holy Spirit upwards of several hundred at least.

That church runs about 30 adults plus kids.

It's not revival if there is no survival of those "revived" (i.e. brought back to life through the Gospel).

Filled pews don't mean much. I don't mean to discount anything, or what God has done or is doing. It's exciting to see babies reborn into the Kingdom. But it's also VERY discouraging to see those "babies" fall away because there wasn't the right structure? ministry? implementation of vision? to keep them.

I know a former missionary to Papua New Guinea who witnessed 7,000 people receive the Holy Spirit at once, only to see almost all of them leave the Apostolic church because there was no way to disciple and fellowship them all.

The 3,000 that were added to the church on Pentecost remained in the church because they "abided in the teachings of the Apostles" (Acts 2:42).

Unless we can get the numbers of people God is adding to us into the apostle's doctrine, all we're ever going to see is waves of people crashing on the shore, only to be taken out again with the tide.

Numbers are an important part of the Bible, but God's never needed numbers to prove Himself to the world.

One saint that gets a deeper revelation and understanding of the Father, who becomes more intimate and transparent with the Lord, and grows thereby, and abides ever more faithfully in the Word, until death takes him or her, is a/the revival that matters.
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Last edited by votivesoul; 01-18-2016 at 10:02 PM.
  #2  
Old 01-18-2016, 08:11 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Discipleship is as important as any initial conversion. You are absolutely correct that the number of people baptized doesn't mean anything if they don't stick around and grow in Christ.
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"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.

"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.

"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."

Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
  #3  
Old 01-18-2016, 08:57 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

The issue at my church is fake infillings. 40 in one tent revival and don't see most again. Hype and crowd manipulation is the order of the day here.
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And someday master you. --Anon.


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  #4  
Old 01-18-2016, 09:09 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
The issue at my church is fake infillings. 40 in one tent revival and don't see most again. Hype and crowd manipulation is the order of the day here.
May I ask why are you still there?
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  #6  
Old 01-20-2016, 08:05 AM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
He knew about growth!
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  #7  
Old 01-18-2016, 09:22 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
May I ask why are you still there?


Praying for direction and not a lot options here.
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Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
  #8  
Old 01-18-2016, 09:24 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
Praying for direction and not a lot options here.
Where do you live?

New York City?
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"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
  #9  
Old 01-18-2016, 09:30 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Where do you live?

New York City?
I live in the new Jerusalem.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
  #10  
Old 01-18-2016, 10:03 PM
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Re: Numerical Growth Is Not A Sign Of Revival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
The issue at my church is fake infillings. 40 in one tent revival and don't see most again. Hype and crowd manipulation is the order of the day here.
Let us fast and pray and seek the Lord together for a change!
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