Some standing here - Page 13

shag · #**121** 10-09-2015, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shag

So based on your response, you are saying that Acts 2:3 is the fulfillment of Matt.16:28, correct?

“Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”

Acts 2:3

3 Then there appeared to them cloven tongues, as of fire, and one sat upon each of them.

Please explain to me how they visibly saw the son of man in Acts 2 with their own eyes. And where does it say that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

The cloven tongues is the Holy Ghost visibly manifested to them all.

The Holy Ghost is Jesus.

Jesus manifested himself to them in that fashion.

It never happened again.

The cloven tongues were a fulfillment of a promise that Jesus would visibly appear in His kingdom.

Isa 19:1 The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD RIDETH UPON A SWIFT "CLOUD", and shall come into Egypt: and the idols of Egypt shall be moved at his presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in the midst of it.

Does scripture record anyone seeing the Lord riding on a cloud, and do you believe they've visibly seen Him riding on a cloud?
And here we have Ejypt melting, yet can you explain about what has taken place with the melting of Ejypt, since you demand planet earth having a meltdown in other scripture?

Yet when Jesus told them they would see the son of man, and even though nobody in Acts 2 actually visibly saw the son of man, you still believe that Matt. 16:28 was fulfilled when it reads:
Matthew 16:

28 "Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

because Acts 2:3 reads that cloven tongues appeared to them.

But then in Revelation the Lord is coming with the clouds, on a white horse, with a sword coming out of his mouth, and you say that's one for the visible eye to see, sword, horse, clouds and all.

And you honestly don't see the conflict of inconsistency?

houston · #**122** 10-10-2015, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

Yes indeed.

Are you a pastor?

Sean · #**123** 10-10-2015, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shag

Isa 19:1 The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD RIDETH UPON A SWIFT "CLOUD", and shall come into Egypt: and the idols of Egypt shall be moved at his presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in the midst of it.

Does scripture record anyone seeing the Lord riding on a cloud, and do you believe they've visibly seen Him riding on a cloud?
And here we have Ejypt melting, yet can you explain about what has taken place with the melting of Ejypt, since you demand planet earth having a meltdown in other scripture?

Yet when Jesus told them they would see the son of man, and even though nobody in Acts 2 actually visibly saw the son of man, you still believe that Matt. 16:28 was fulfilled when it reads:
Matthew 16:

28 "Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

because Acts 2:3 reads that cloven tongues appeared to them.

But then in Revelation the Lord is coming with the clouds, on a white horse, with a sword coming out of his mouth, and you say that's one for the visible eye to see, sword, horse, clouds and all.

And you honestly don't see the conflict of inconsistency?

Did you expect the son of man to re-appear to them the same way he looked, after the ascension, as he was speaking to them, before his death?

Do you think the son of man cannot appear in different forms after the ascension?

Do you think he is confined to a human body?

If so, please show us some writings of when the son of man visibly returned in his kingdom in a document of some type in 70ad.

I will even accept the National Enquirer, Preterist Archives or Planet Preterist.

shag · #**124** 10-10-2015, 12:04 PM

Sean, I realize the Holyghost is none other than the spirit of Jesus Christ residing in the nt born again disciple. Duh.

I realize he was unrecognized post resurrection when they walked with him. Duh.

I also realize that you absolutely refused to respond to the questions in my post, and respond in an honest manner, with yourself and with me.

I'll try not continue to waste our time on this.

Sean · #**125** 10-10-2015, 12:10 PM

Discussing ones' point of view is not a waste of time, bro. It is about sharing ideas, thinking outside the box and coming to a conclusion.

All questions or comments matter here.

They just make us think.

Ultimately, we gather all the info we can and come to our own conclusions.

shazeep · #**126** 10-10-2015, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

Discussing ones' point of view is not a waste of time, bro. It is about sharing ideas, thinking outside the box and coming to a conclusion.

All questions or comments matter here.

They just make us think.

Ultimately, we gather all the info we can and come to our own conclusions.

i think what shaq is saying, Sean, is that he is not really getting answers from you that would help to understand your position. Like the sword question, for instance--even an "i don't know" would at least be some kind of honest answer, no one is requiring that every blank be filled in here. What is your vision on the sword? Or you might answer shaq more directly, ty.

Sean · #**127** 10-10-2015, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

i think what shaq is saying, Sean, is that he is not really getting answers from you that would help to understand your position. Like the sword question, for instance--even an "i don't know" would at least be some kind of honest answer, no one is requiring that every blank be filled in here. What is your vision on the sword? Or you might answer shaq more directly, ty.

Oh, okay, it is a supernatural sword, proceeding from a supernatural God.

Sean · #**128** 10-10-2015, 12:40 PM

My point is I believe EXACTLY the description of our Lord Jesus as depicted in Rev. 19, to the letter.

To try to make it say something other than we read is weakening the description of His great power imposed upon the Gentiles of planet earth.

shazeep · #**129** 10-10-2015, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

My point is I believe EXACTLY the description of our Lord Jesus as depicted in Rev. 19, to the letter.

To try to make it say something other than we read is weakening the description of His great power imposed upon the Gentiles of planet earth.

i could not agree more, and as long as you are settled in your own mind on your position, then that is what you should proclaim but i suggest to you that beliefs evolve over time if examined and you might admit to some more spiritual interpretation of a Book that is after all titled The Revelation even if you don't personally adhere to it.

I doubt any believer ever would suggest that a basic tenet of their faith is not that Christ was here and will return in some manner, and you are quibbling over semantics, essentially, insisting that Christ come literally riding in on a white horse shooting laser beams in some physically violent gore-fest finale, with blood literally up to horse's bridles (which simply would not be possible in one battle; it represents the blood of all who have died) and i say that because i bet most any pre would agree with you even, that all that might happen just as you say, physically, for your eyes to witness, at some future date.

So you might be right. But what if you are wrong? What if all of those are meant to convey spiritual principles? Well then, you have a responsibility, other than just waiting around and coming up with new dates, and frankly that seems to universally scare futurists to death.

mfblume · #**130** 10-10-2015, 01:06 PM

Some are so overly lacking it's unbelievable.