Alex, I have a suggestion for you. Instead of hijacking a thread intended for people who want to share their appreciation and love for their church organization, why not start your own thread on house churches? It's a topic that has been discussed before. Everything from altars to steeples to elders instead of pastors, etc.
I have grown increasingly frustrated with posters bashing the UPC. I totally understand that many have had some very negative and hurtful experiences while attending a UPC church; however, holding on to the pain while tearing down the organization at every chance hasn't done anyone any good.
I have experienced hurt too and I thought that I would never go back, but I realized that if change was every going to occur it would be better orchestrated from within.
Instead of bashing the UPCI why not pray for your local church and the leadership? Stop hating and start loving!!!
Not enough time to catch up in reading all the posts here. I think that alot of us have. I am in a UPC church for my families sake. It is not totally my choice but I am glad I am there...could be in worse places. That being said I am not a huge fan of somethings in the UPCI. As a whole the UPCI is mostly fine. I have had some bad experiences. Some have had great experiences and some like me have not. I am not against the UPCI as I have stated I am in it. It is a family and not all family gets along. Not all family sees eye to eye either. I think that are great things outside the UPCI and great things within. I do not think that either opinion whether good or bad can be painted with a broad brush. Personally, I have prayed for the UPCI and I have seen some changes enough to choose to come back. I am not standing with one foot out the door, but I am not saying I will stay forever either. I DO LOVE THE UPCI, THOUGH I AM NOT MARRIED TO IT. You can love someone and not totally agree with them.
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"If we don't learn to live together we're gonna die alone"
Jack Shephard.
Alex, I have a suggestion for you. Instead of hijacking a thread intended for people who want to share their appreciation and love for their church organization, why not start your own thread on house churches? It's a topic that has been discussed before. Everything from altars to steeples to elders instead of pastors, etc.
Now, there's an idea!
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Isaiah 53:5: "But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed."(KJV)
"God sends no one away empty except those who are full of themselves." Dwight L. Moody
I have grown increasingly frustrated with posters bashing the UPC. I totally understand that many have had some very negative and hurtful experiences while attending a UPC church; however, holding on to the pain while tearing down the organization at every chance hasn't done anyone any good.
I have experienced hurt too and I thought that I would never go back, but I realized that if change was every going to occur it would be better orchestrated from within.
Instead of bashing the UPCI why not pray for your local church and the leadership? Stop hating and start loving!!![/QUOTE]
Not enough time to catch up in reading all the posts here. I think that alot of us have. I am in a UPC church for my families sake. It is not totally my choice but I am glad I am there...could be in worse places. That being said I am not a huge fan of somethings in the UPCI. As a whole the UPCI is mostly fine. I have had some bad experiences. Some have had great experiences and some like me have not. I am not against the UPCI as I have stated I am in it. It is a family and not all family gets along. Not all family sees eye to eye either. I think that are great things outside the UPCI and great things within. I do not think that either opinion whether good or bad can be painted with a broad brush. Personally, I have prayed for the UPCI and I have seen some changes enough to choose to come back. I am not standing with one foot out the door, but I am not saying I will stay forever either. I DO LOVE THE UPCI, THOUGH I AM NOT MARRIED TO IT. You can love someone and not totally agree with them.
Great post! To be honest, there are some UPC churches that I don't think I could attend. Just like all other organizations/denominations, the UPC has churches that really demonstrate what it means to be a "Christian" church and ones that are completely opposite.
For instance, knowing that the church that I attended in California was still overlorded by the leadership, stifling out anything that didn't fit their idea of holiness to the point of being offensive, I would rather attend somewhere else than to subject myself to that again.
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Isaiah 53:5: "But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed."(KJV)
"God sends no one away empty except those who are full of themselves." Dwight L. Moody
Yup we don't see altars in Scripture, except in the OT and we don't see altar calls... hmmm... could we do without them? You bet!
Testimony services- the apostles didn't tell of what GOD was doing in and through them to exhort their brethren? They sure did (although it was probably in a house church/dinner-table type setting).
Ladies meetings- The older women are told to teach the younger women, having the ladies get together for fellowship is great for them.
HG shoutdowns- I have no clue what that is. A move of GOD though in the assembly is very much Biblical.
We could go through each knit-picking thing, but none of these are so great matters as to how the very Church is RUN. Bishops, elders, deacons, the 5-fold ministry, are all very Biblical. General Superindentents are just as unbiblical as Popes and Cardinals, and a compendium of rules that bind or break fellowship is as unbiblical as a catechism, and the LORD detests such things.
GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex
And still no scriptural support for that statement.
If you are going to speak for God, show where God speaks for Himself in such matters.
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
It's not all about house churches. I can definately see the validity of having services in a public meetinghouse. However, if we're going to say we love something, like the UPC, the question is does GOD love the UPC. I believe the UPC is not GOD's plan for HIS Church, neither do I believe any denomination, whether it be ALJC, PAW or what have you is GOD's plan. Is it supported in Scripture these denominations? Are the offices in Scripture? Is the division and causing the Church to not "all say the same thing" part of GOD's plan?
Alex, I have a suggestion for you. Instead of hijacking a thread intended for people who want to share their appreciation and love for their church organization, why not start your own thread on house churches? It's a topic that has been discussed before. Everything from altars to steeples to elders instead of pastors, etc.
*bump*
Alex, the things you are proposing have some merit, Bro. Start a thread about it and see where the conversation goes.
I left the UPC over a year ago, though I still have family and friends in the UPC. It's not a perfect organization, but it has done a lot of good and which has a lot of good people and churches. Sure, there are some bad apples in the mix, but that's true of any organization.
I enjoy the church I'm a part of now, which is non-denominal/independent, though thoroughly apostolic/pentecostal in practice and belief. I can say it's the only church I've been a part of that has reached across denominal lines and truly fellowshipped with independents, PAWs, UPC, Apostolics and those considered charasmatic because of dress standards. It's one of the reasons we want to stay unaffiliated with any organization.
Politics and personal ambitions of a few have caused a big distaste in most organizations for me ... and not just in the UPC. This has weakened many organizations.
God Bless the UPC, Apostolics, PAWs, PAJC, ALJC, Independents and any other Oneness churches/organizations out there.
It's not all about house churches. I can definately see the validity of having services in a public meetinghouse. However, if we're going to say we love something, like the UPC, the question is does GOD love the UPC. I believe the UPC is not GOD's plan for HIS Church, neither do I believe any denomination, whether it be ALJC, PAW or what have you is GOD's plan. Is it supported in Scripture these denominations? Are the offices in Scripture? Is the division and causing the Church to not "all say the same thing" part of GOD's plan?
GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex
Alex, please show scriptural support for your claim that God detests organizations.
Silence in scripture isn't supporting your claim.
And it's ok to admit that you don't have scriptural support, but if that's the case, I'd stop speaking for God when support is lacking.
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
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