UPC General Conference updates

[TRFrance]

Originally Posted by Ron

I believe in a 3 step Gospel that has three separate important parts!

Reference I use is the Bible!

Well said Ron.

And also, I've always contended that the idea that the so-called "3-stepper gospel" did not exist before the early 20th century, as some assert, is scriptural and historically unprovable.

[Ron]

My Pastor just got back from GC & while he didn't hear any rumours of Sarah Palin speaking at GC, he did see her bus in the city.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Well said Ron.

And also, I've always contended that the idea that the so-called "3-stepper gospel" did not exist before the early 20th century, as some assert, is scriptural and historically unprovable.

I'm not going to hijack this thread, however, I think historically, there is probably a good case that the oneness view of the godhead has existed in some form throughout the ages. There also have been those who have baptized in Jesus' name and we all know that the HGB has been received throughout the ages as well in different pockets. However, the doctrine that a person is not saved until after they have spoken in tongues IS a product of the 20th century and does not have historical roots or precedents.

I've never discounted the death, burial & resurrection gospel, but the idea that one is not rapture ready unless they speak in tongues, I think, is preposterous. I won't comment any more on this thread because I know that is not its topic, but I'm only making these comments based on earlier ones regarding the gospel.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Well said Ron.

And also, I've always contended that the idea that the so-called "3-stepper gospel" did not exist before the early 20th century, as some assert, is scriptural and historically unprovable.

Exactly! In Acts 10:43-48:

(43) To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

(44) While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

(45) And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

(46) For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

(47) Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

(48) And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 2:38 says to Repent AND be baptized for the remission of sins and you SHALL receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

We can clearly see that the Gentiles fulfilled all points of Acts 2:38 and this was said of them:

Acts 11:1 And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received (accepted) the word of God.

They knew by those things - repentance, baptism and the infilling of the Holy Ghost with evidence of speaking in tongues - they had received (accepted) the word of God.

Galatians 1:8-9:

(8) But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

(9) As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

[Brad Murphy]

I accept that the Jesus name baptism may have been around in pockets, but I sure don't see anyone producing either a family genealogical legacy or any organization producing any historical documentation that they have existed in some form since Christ's time. I'm talking about historical documentation that dates back more than a hundred years or so... The only "Christian" religion that can make any claims at all is the Catholic church and those churches who were created in the various break-offs from it... and yes, I have the Word document that someone threw together which "proves" an unbroken line of Apostolics all the way back to Christ's time.

I can't start a company in 2007 and say that people have been doing what I do for 50 years, therefore my company is 50 years old.... just because some pocket of people that no one has ever had any contact with may have done something does not mean you can claim it as part of your personal legacy.

Black swan theory again... since no one has ever seen a black swan, that doesn't mean they do not exist, so you can't prove that they didn't.... kind of a catch-22.

[Rose]

Priscilla McGruder received the Lifetime Achievement Award from the Pentecostal Music Association on Wed Eve at the Conference. Though she looked weak, her testimony was and is still strong... believing for another miracle that God is healing her of bone cancer just as He healed her of breast cancer!!!!!
Praise the Lord!

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Rose

Priscilla McGruder received the Lifetime Achievement Award from the Pentecostal Music Association on Wed Eve at the Conference. Though she looked weak, her testimony was and is still strong... believing for another miracle that God is healing her of bone cancer just as He healed her of breast cancer!!!!!
Praise the Lord!

Never heard of such a thing. I wasn't aware that there were lifetime achievement awards given out.

You learn something new every day.

[meBNme]

Originally Posted by 1399

TRFRANCE,

I have thought for a long time that the verse you ref'd speaks of the "rock" being Jesus' identity as the "Son of God".

The whole Gospel is built upon the fact that our Jesus is THE CHRIST the Son of the Living God.

Matthew 16
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

It seems apparent to me that the Rock is Peter himself and the message he would preach, containing the keys to the kingdom of heaven. That message that Peter preached when he revealed the keys in Acts 2:38, and the revelation that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God.... That is the rock that Jesus built his Church on. The church that the gates of hell will not prevail against.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Sam

This has been a "controversy" among Oneness folks for some time now.

We used to be taught that there was an early and latter rain i.e. an outpouring of the Spirit in the first century and another in the "last days" that we are in now. It was also taught that the "truth" was lost or buried or stolen in 325 AD and was gradually rediscovered by Martin Luther, John Calvin, etc until it was "fully restored" in 1914.

Later, some have taught that there were "always" some who taught "oneness, baptism by immersion in Jesus' name, and the HGB (Holy Ghost Baptism) with the "initial physical evidence" of speaking with other tongues." This was based on some obscure and vague references throughout history of variations in doctrine on the nature of God; references to those who taught "believers' baptism" and/or baptism by immersion; and references to spiritual gifts being manifested at different times and places.

From studying it out my opinion is, both are true. I do believe that as the roman church grew along with the drifting away of the original church (such as we see mentioned even in revelation-leaving your first love,etc.) That the church doctrinally that Jesus founded was more or less scatted underground groups that were persecuted by the recognized church throughout history. In the mean time, our od who loves all souls also began to restore the mainline church one truth at a time, growing from Luther, Wesley, Campbell, etc. Until the modern pentecostal revival.

I am not claiming to be an expert,and I am not saying it is a slam dunk, but I certainly do think this is not terribly far fetched, especially when considering the evedence.

[SoCaliUPC]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Never heard of such a thing. I wasn't aware that there were lifetime achievement awards given out.

You learn something new every day.

The PMA has been doing this for the past 3 years now. They have honored men and woman such as the Urshans, J,Hugh Rose, Steve Richardson, C.M. Becton, Bobbie Shoemake, The McGruders. It is the Music Ministry of the UPC giving honor to those who have made a difference, musically, in the Apostolic world.