The "Not Drunk" deception

Originally Posted by jaxfam6

so you have grown up and become to mature to dance a good ole David jig in church. Thats nice, now get over the fact that we are not as old and mature as you and leave us to our David jigs while you and his wife stand by the window and criticize us. Your womb may be shut up like hers in the process.

LOL,,, I love it,.. people who still believe she was laughing and angry at his worship..... sheesh the Pentecostal will do anything prove they can shout if they want to.....

As has already been settled before.. she was not angry at his worship.. she was jealous and furious because had disrobed in front of the other women, he had left his royal robes and slipped into priestly robes.. she was FURIOUS not at his worship... David had been worshipping all of his life.. his wife had seen him worship countless times..... COME ON FOLKS.. you really believe God shut her womb because she had matured to the place she couldnt SHOUT NO MORE...... oh man

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

You're funny. You're parallel in equating emotional worship w/ mass murder is odd.

But you'll preach where there are this fleshly displays ...

Will you do so where people are literally massacring others?

I'll preach the gospel in a hogs pen..... I just wont become a Hog

[jaxfam6]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

I'll preach the gospel in a hogs pen..... I just wont become a Hog

Isn't there something about casting pearls before swine?

Okay allow me to be very pointed here. No mistake wanted on this one.
I am saying that I think arguing with you is like throwing pearls before swine. If that is not acceptable than fine do what you all must. I have abstained from conversations with you because I believe this very STRONGLY. I always have to go with my prayer instinct. Unfortunately I gave into a moment of weakness on this one.

ironic to me that you would actually use the words pig pen and hog when I feel the way I do about discussing Bible with you. And that from just reading the things others have said with you and your responses to them.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

I'll preach the gospel in a hogs pen..... I just wont become a Hog

There you go Pentecostals are hogs ...

Have a nice day.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

We did this thread w/ you already.

That is what I was gonna say and as I recall he kept ignoring my points then getting mad when I kept bumping them up and pointing out he was ignoring them. He later then claimed I was being mean or something.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

What say ye?

The Pentecostals for years have tried to point to the "These are not drunk as ye suppose" statement to give some kind of credence to their acting drunk in church.....

First of all we don't say we should ACT drunk.

Read the whole story in cotext and heres my challenge show me ONE REFERENCE where they were talking about these peoples worship... you know what never mind.. Ill do it for you

Pentecostals don't say this was a reference to their worship. They say it was a reference to the effect of the Spirit on them.

CONTEXT a beautiful thing
Acts 2:6 - Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.

Why were they confounded or confused?

# 1 Because they saw people shouting all over the place.....
# 2 Because they saw people running and screaming
# 3 Because common people had broken the language barrier

BINGO #3

I don't think Any Pentecostal says they were confounded because they saw people running and screaming. And if I saw people running I would not consider them drunk. Drunks don't run very well.

Now, moving right along

Acts 2:7 - And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?

Why were the amazed and bewlidered and counfounded?

# 1 - The heard people laughing in the Spirit all over the place
# 2 - They saw folks leaping for joy
# 3 - Because common folks broke the language barrier

BINGO #3

Strawman. OPs don't say they were amazed because of the first 2

Moving right along

OK HERES THE QUESTION

Acts 2:8 -And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

So what is the subject of the conversation or the question they are asking?

# 1 - Why are these people so happy
# 2 - Why are these folks dancing and shouting all over the place
# 3 - How do common folks speak in our languages

BINGO - #3

We all know the context.

CONTEXT BREAK -- So far what is the subject at hand? TONGUES...... do you see any reference to Praise or Worship?

Yes I do see a reference to praise and Worship in the very verses in you skipped

Great, moving right along

We skip verse 9,10 & 11 because it is just listing all the languages they heard them speaking in

Act 2:8 And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language?
Act 2:9 Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia,
Act 2:10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome,
Act 2:11 both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians--we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God." <--That is PRAISE

So we pick up at verse 12 to find the CONTEXT,., whether it be worship and shouting or whether it be something else..... the PENTECOSTALS desperatly need for it to be worship and shouting

No uh "WE" Pentecostals do not disparately need for it to be anything. A sweeping generalization. A Strawman argument and prejudicial language.

Acts 2:12 - And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

Question- What were they amazed at?

# 1 - Peoples ability to shout and not get hurt?
# 2 - Peoples ability to dance uncontrollably
# 3 - Peoples ability to speak in foreign languages

BINGo # 3 - They are wanting to know all about this ability to break the language barrier and here they are trying to figure out where this new ability has come from.. they marvelled, they were amazed

Pentecostals will agree they were amazed because they heard them speaking in their language. Again the "Dr" operates in logical fallacies. And it seems odd that on the other hand he tries to speak favorably of Pentecostals...Oh he has family. Oh he still preaches for them...yet as you will later see we are all pigs according to him

and with this context in mind... we come to the next scripture

Acts 2:13 - Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.

WHY DID THEY ACCUSE THEM OF DRINKING NEW WINE?

With all of the above scriptures taken in context please answer the following questions

#1 - because they saw them acting drunk
#2 - because they saw them shouting
#3 - because they heard them break the language barrier

BINGO # 3 --- had NOTHING TO DO WITH Pentecostal emotionalism

I have to ask, what about being drunk makes someone speak in a language they did not understand?

Acts 2:15 - For these are not drunken, as ye suppose

No sir,,, they didn't get this ability from a new wine... they got this ability from on high..... as prophesied by Joel... God said he would speak to his people with stammering lips and foreign lanagues.. and this is what you are seeing


So help me OLDPATHS... did you see a PENTECOSTAL service happening anywhere in the study of context?

This was not a service at all. It was them being filled with the Spirit. Question, what were they doing leading up to receiving the Spirit. Eating lunch? Drinking Tea? Chatting with each other? Praying?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

but I thought you guys believed... .these are not drunk was concerning people shouting and dancing and jerking and such as that.. when did that change.. yall have preached it for years

Sweeping Generalization again by the "Dr". You'd think with his education he would know better.

Dr. Nobody knows HOW they were behaving other than the tongues. You can't say they weren't laughing. You can't say any of them were not rejoicing. You just don't know

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

You're funny. You're parallel in equating emotional worship w/ mass murder is odd.

But you'll preach where there are this fleshly displays ...

Will you do so where people are literally massacring others?

Contradictory isn't it?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Dr. Vaughn

LOL,,, I love it,.. people who still believe she was laughing and angry at his worship..... sheesh the Pentecostal will do anything prove they can shout if they want to.....

As has already been settled before.. she was not angry at his worship.. she was jealous and furious because had disrobed in front of the other women, he had left his royal robes and slipped into priestly robes.. she was FURIOUS not at his worship... David had been worshipping all of his life.. his wife had seen him worship countless times..... COME ON FOLKS.. you really believe God shut her womb because she had matured to the place she couldnt SHOUT NO MORE...... oh man

It's amazing. This man will moan later on how he never said anything to us or about us and then when the people here reciprocate to his posting style he just complains.

That she was jealous, if that is the case (ironic considering that David had several wives and concubines) is irrelevant. He was worshiping the LORD by dancing...something you call just emotionalism and ridicule Pentecostals over

[QUOTE=Praxeas;536184]First of all we don't say we should ACT drunk.


Pentecostals don't say this was a reference to their worship. They say it was a reference to the effect of the Spirit on them.

MY RESPONSE: Wrong.. go to campmeeting or Sunday night service right in the middle of the pandamoneum with a few folks in the floor some do the head bang and watch a preacher grab the MIC "THESE ARE NOT DRUNK AS YE SUPPOSE' now tell me again the Pentecostal don't reference this in their worship... even you know better

I don't think Any Pentecostal says they were confounded because they saw people running and screaming. And if I saw people running I would not consider them drunk. Drunks don't run very well.


Strawman. OPs don't say they were amazed because of the first 2


We all know the context.


Yes I do see a reference to praise and Worship in the very verses in you skipped


Act 2:8 And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language?
Act 2:9 Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia,
Act 2:10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome,
Act 2:11 both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians--we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God." <--That is PRAISE

TELLING IS PRAISE????????? Pray tell... lets read it again.... the purpose of this outpouring was evangelization, even you cant argue with that... so if we have a purpose of Evangalization... and we have people TELLING about GOD ... NOW REMEMBER.. I thought PRAISE & WORSHIP was TO GOD.... but these folks are telling folks ABOUT GOD...... so would you mind once again telling us HOW you get PRAISE OUT OF THIS?