The Trouble With Apostolics is...

[Hoovie]

Broad brush? Yes, I agree there, even while I can see some truth in the first post.

The primary issue we face is recognizing and acknowledging that we have and fight the same battles as other Christians do too.

[Sam]

for something more positive about the church, check out my post from a couple of months ago at
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=39494

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Sam

for something more positive about the church, check out my post from a couple of months ago at
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=39494

This is my post that I referenced above.

It was titled "I Believe in the Church"

This is an email I sent out to a lot of people back in January of this year. I've been thinking about some of the things that were said and I thought I would share this with AFF.


I believe in the Church -- God’s Church, the Body of Christ, the Church of Jesus Christ or whatever you may know it by. Jesus called it “My Church” and “the Church” and promised to “build up” or "edify" it. So Jesus Christ has a Church -- His Church -- and many of us are privileged to be a part of it. I’m tired of hearing people knock it, criticize it, or act like their tiny part of it is the whole thing. I’m tired of people thinking that it is irrelevant or that it is failing or losing the battle. I’m proud to be a part of it.



I saw some inspiring words on Facebook by a young pastor that I respect very highly. He ministers in California and I would like to pass his words on. He gave me permission to share this.



I still believe in a church where grace is real and not just a song, where Peter can deny Christ with vulgarities and his ministry still be received, even better than ever, just weeks later as the featured speaker the day the church was birthed. I still believe in a church that celebrates the meth addict, the single mom, and the pregnant teen even if the Luke 15 older brother is pissed off about it. I still believe in a church that can buck the trend of 90%+ of American church growth resulting from people changing churches, and instead, proclaim that, like Jesus, we are here not for the whole but for the sick. I still believe in a church that desires to make disciples, not republicans, and I still believe in a church that is a spiritual emergency room, not a business enterprise. I still believe in a church that will be raised up out of the culture rather than secluded from culture, and I'm absolutely convinced that "The Church" despite the fact that my most agonizing moments in life are a result of it, is the most wonderful living organism on the face of the earth. I refuse to believe in the word "hopeless". I refuse to believe in the word "Impossible." I refuse to believe that I cannot stand on the rock upon which Christ will build His Church, a church that impacts culture so much that the gates of hell cannot prevail against it.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Sam

This is my post that I referenced above.

It was titled "I Believe in the Church"

This is an email I sent out to a lot of people back in January of this year. I've been thinking about some of the things that were said and I thought I would share this with AFF.


I believe in the Church -- God’s Church, the Body of Christ, the Church of Jesus Christ or whatever you may know it by. Jesus called it “My Church” and “the Church” and promised to “build up” or "edify" it. So Jesus Christ has a Church -- His Church -- and many of us are privileged to be a part of it. I’m tired of hearing people knock it, criticize it, or act like their tiny part of it is the whole thing. I’m tired of people thinking that it is irrelevant or that it is failing or losing the battle. I’m proud to be a part of it.



I saw some inspiring words on Facebook by a young pastor that I respect very highly. He ministers in California and I would like to pass his words on. He gave me permission to share this.



I still believe in a church where grace is real and not just a song, where Peter can deny Christ with vulgarities and his ministry still be received, even better than ever, just weeks later as the featured speaker the day the church was birthed. I still believe in a church that celebrates the meth addict, the single mom, and the pregnant teen even if the Luke 15 older brother is pissed off about it. I still believe in a church that can buck the trend of 90%+ of American church growth resulting from people changing churches, and instead, proclaim that, like Jesus, we are here not for the whole but for the sick. I still believe in a church that desires to make disciples, not republicans, and I still believe in a church that is a spiritual emergency room, not a business enterprise. I still believe in a church that will be raised up out of the culture rather than secluded from culture, and I'm absolutely convinced that "The Church" despite the fact that my most agonizing moments in life are a result of it, is the most wonderful living organism on the face of the earth. I refuse to believe in the word "hopeless". I refuse to believe in the word "Impossible." I refuse to believe that I cannot stand on the rock upon which Christ will build His Church, a church that impacts culture so much that the gates of hell cannot prevail against it.

Sounds like somethin Gene Scott would have said...

[shag]

Originally Posted by Charnock

The movement was founded on experience and feeling instead of solid Bible exegesis.

The movement has historically given entirely too much authority to pastors, which has led to rampant spiritual abuse.

The movement doesn't have a consistent doctrine concerning justification, nor does it attempt to understand this beautiful Bible cornerstone.

The movement loves standards of holiness more than the spirit of holiness.

The movement is all about visible measurements instead of inner purity.

The movement exists solely as a counter-Christian enterprise, and does not seriously attempt to evangelize the world.

The movement assumes the world knows the Bible, and rejects it.

The movement eats its own.

Maybe try writing something positive....

[AreYouReady?]

Sam, you are a great man of God. I wish that there were many more just like you in the church.

And I am not talking about any one sect.

[houston]

Originally Posted by shag

Get a life. Maybe try writing something positive....

You don't agree?

[Michael The Disciple]

The movement was founded on experience and feeling instead of solid Bible exegesis.

Totally wrong. It actually brought the doctrine of the Apostles concerning the new birth and the oneness of God into clear focus.

The movement doesn't have a consistent doctrine concerning justification, nor does it attempt to understand this beautiful Bible cornerstone.

Totally false. Apostolics are the only Churches on Earth who teach justification in line with the Apostles.

The movement loves standards of holiness more than the spirit of holiness.

The movement is all about visible measurements instead of inner purity.

Some truth to this. On the other hand some Apostolics are given to heart purity.

The movement exists solely as a counter-Christian enterprise, and does not seriously attempt to evangelize the world.

Again false. Tho I am nobody I have preached by way of radio in 6 nations. By way of internet I cant say how many. I have presented the name of Jesus to thousands of people in the communities where I have lived.

By saying this I am just demonstrating that there are Apostolics who have done what they could to reach souls. I am just one example.

The movement assumes the world knows the Bible, and rejects it.

As to America its a fair assumption. We cant give up on young people they have NOT had their chance yet many of them.

The movement eats its own.

Somewhat true. They put me out long ago over wearing a beard, a watch and short sleeves. Not because I was flaunting my liberty but just for thinking I had it. I dont feel very welcome where I am trying to go to Church even now.

The movement has historically given entirely too much authority to pastors, which has led to rampant spiritual abuse.

They have followed Protestant tradition making one man rule a tenant of faith. Most other groups are the same way with the same results.

[shag]

Originally Posted by houston

You don't agree?

I can find plenty of holes in some "modern day apostolic legalistic teaching", but his list is unnecessary, 100% negative, and what exactly is the purpose? He should atleast find positive things to say as well, as there is positive things too. Maybe read Phil. 4:8 a few times...

[Praxeas]

The Movement is NOT monolithic. Sorry but whiny sweeping generalizations are boring