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09-14-2016, 01:20 PM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by aegsm76
I know many of the people in leadership there.
Good people.
But we do disagree on a few issues.
And I remember when we did not.
And it was not I that changed.
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No doubt! The same could be said of me by a lot of people.
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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09-14-2016, 06:45 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 14,650
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
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By majors I believe the pastor means the primary foundational beliefs of Christianity (which I know differ from the foundational beliefs of old time Oneness Pentecostals).
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Wow so they or you believe old time Pentecostals are not Christians! Thats nice to know.
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09-14-2016, 09:00 PM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
Wow so they or you believe old time Pentecostals are not Christians! Thats nice to know.
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No, not at all. I apologize if my writing was not clear. Did it today while also working in my home office. I just meant what this church considers foundational doctrine is different from what old time Pentecostals do in the sense that for UPC etc pentecostals the three step salvation plan, uncut hair on women, no makeup, etc, etc are considered foundational doctrines. You took quite a leap to say that my church considers those people not Christian. I would say the opposite is actually true. We consider those three step folks brothers in Christ where most of them would not consider us that.
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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09-14-2016, 09:43 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Portage la Prairie, MB CANADA
Posts: 38,161
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
No, not at all. I apologize if my writing was not clear. Did it today while also working in my home office. I just meant what this church considers foundational doctrine is different from what old time Pentecostals do in the sense that for UPC etc pentecostals the three step salvation plan, uncut hair on women, no makeup, etc, etc are considered foundational doctrines. You took quite a leap to say that my church considers those people not Christian. I would say the opposite is actually true. We consider those three step folks brothers in Christ where most of them would not consider us that.
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I still think a" three step" description is offkey.
Anyway...
__________________
...MY THOUGHTS, ANYWAY.
"Many Christians do not try to understand what was written in a verse in the Bible. Instead they approach the passage to prove what they already believe."
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09-15-2016, 07:08 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfblume
I still think a" three step" description is offkey.
Anyway...
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Flat or sharp? 
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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09-15-2016, 07:15 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
My thought in posting the video was that it was the best sermon I have heard that covers the churches philosophy, approach etc in a A-Z fashion.
Growing up UPC and being either in it or around it for many decades I believe has given me a pretty good insight into old time Pentecosts philosophy and approach to church.
For many UPC and other old time Pentecost folks they look at a church like mine and think they know its philosophy and approach but I believe that many times they really don't. I say that because I have listened to UPC sermons and saints deplore what they believe churches that deviate from traditional church are about and it certainly has never reflected my church. So the idea is not to debate doctrine or convert anybody but just to offer up some insight to a different approach to church.
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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09-15-2016, 08:15 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,903
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Actually to me the approach is much like the "Jesus people" of the 70's. I knew some of them this seems to be the same philosophy maybe a little more organized?
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09-15-2016, 09:48 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Epley
Actually to me the approach is much like the "Jesus people" of the 70's. I knew some of them this seems to be the same philosophy maybe a little more organized?
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Interesting. I don't know anything about the Jesus People movement of the 70's but can confirm that we are very organized.
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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09-15-2016, 10:33 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,903
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
Interesting. I don't know anything about the Jesus People movement of the 70's but can confirm that we are very organized.
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The format is much of the same. They baptized in Jesus name wasn't a big deal to them but they did it. However they were as the majority not very organized. David Berg came out from them that scandalized the movement but those that I knew were not of his stripe. Doctrine meant very little.
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09-15-2016, 10:38 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Unconventional Church "Vision" Service
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Epley
The format is much of the same. They baptized in Jesus name wasn't a big deal to them but they did it. However they were as the majority not very organized. David Berg came out from them that scandalized the movement but those that I knew were not of his stripe. Doctrine meant very little.
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It is not that doctrine means very little at my church it is just that we are not going to sit and argue about various views of matters that are not core to salvation. Things like prophecy, church government, etc. We consider ourselves extremely doctrinal in the sense that we go through the bible word for word and deal with everything it says and in context.
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
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