Once Saved Always Saved - Page 27

shazeep · #**261** 11-23-2015, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

I have been telling you I agree, but all of that comes after the faith in Christ's death on the cross. And you said carrying the cross saves anyone in any religion, but you are not dealing with the passages in the bible that state the death of Christ as us, that moves God to make us righteous before we have a chance to love anybody, COMES FIRST. And if that is not seen in a person's life, no matter how much they carry a cross, they are lost. You will not deal with the scriptures that state this. You avoided it then and you are still avoiding them now.

You say I misinterpret a passage, and question why I noted context, and YOU STILL do not show the correct meaning in them. I am getting the drift. You won't talk about them, will you? Are you fearful you will be shown to be wrong in this? Again, do you go to church?

Again, a pox on your dead church--i AM the Church. The rest of this is pretty much bunk--i answered you, you could not read it, and so you reply from that pov. Post a verse, and i will reply to it. One verse, okay? Let's not get too bogged down.

shazeep · #**262** 11-23-2015, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

I never said anything about no need to bear fruit. Why the red herrings?

the red herring is putting this second, instead of first. One's proclamations at the altar serve no one, except possibly themselves.

mfblume · #**263** 11-23-2015, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

Again, a pox on your dead church--i AM the Church. The rest of this is pretty much bunk--i answered you, you could not read it, and so you reply from that pov. Post a verse, and i will reply to it. One verse, okay? Let's not get too bogged down.

Pick a verse I posted and prove to me you're serious, because I cannot see it in you. You're stalling.

Tell you what... deal with this one, as silly as it is to say ONE VERSE.

Romans 4:6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

Verses are not meant to contain an entire thought, but are for reference sake. But anyway, let's see what you do.

shazeep · #**264** 11-23-2015, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Trying to be saved by works and is like a branch trying to bear fruit and not being connected to any overall vine.

You do not want to see that for some reason.

But you won't look. It's a game to you. You simply cannot understand nor deal with the scriptures I posted and are obviously trying to see how long you can pull me along before I realize you're playing. Sorry, I thought you were honest about this.

Well, i knew that you could only tell the lie that was repeated to you, even if you mean well. This is not salvation by works, no matter how much you try to make it so. It is about the state of the First Son's heart.

shazeep · #**265** 11-23-2015, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Pick a verse I posted and prove to me you're serious, because I cannot see it in you. You're stalling.

Tell you what... deal with this one, as silly as it is to say ONE VERSE.

Romans 4:6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

Verses are not meant to contain an entire thought, but are for reference sake. But anyway, let's see what you do.

a perfect description of the Good Samaritan, before the incident on the road.

shazeep · #**266** 11-23-2015, 10:50 AM

"13For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants that he would inherit the world was not through the law, but through the righteousness that comes by faith."

see that you are taking a "Grace is better than Law" argument and trying to fit it into a different context.

shazeep · #**267** 11-23-2015, 10:52 AM

Okay, now it's my turn:

If what you say is true, what keeps one from waiting until their deathbed to claim Acts 2:38?

mfblume · #**268** 11-23-2015, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

the red herring is putting this second, instead of first. One's proclamations at the altar serve no one, except possibly themselves.

That is a red flag to me. All the passages I quoted that show the FIRST work that God MUST do to anyone is the cross, and you poo-poo it to a second rate deal. The applied work of the cross is greater than anything, even the fruit we must bear. It is blasphemy to say the work of Christ's death on the cross is second and not first.

But I suppose if you think others who deny his very crucifixion can carry a cross for God to save them, then what else would the cross be than a second rate deal:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Q'uran

Surah 4:157, Women...

"And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Isa son of Marium, the apostle of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so (like Isa) and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure."

shazeep · #**269** 11-23-2015, 10:52 AM

How do you interpret the Vineyard Owner with Two Sons?

mfblume · #**270** 11-23-2015, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shazeep

Okay, now it's my turn:

If what you say is true, what keeps one from waiting until their deathbed to claim Acts 2:38?

I have seen people do it and I believe God accepted it. God makes us righteous before we get a chanced to lift a finger to do good.

Now, why all these hypotheticals rather than dealing with actual scripture?