The Persecution of Women in the Church

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Newman

Praxeas-

1. Do you disagree with the statement "The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world"?

Yes I also disagree that the moon is made out of green cheese. I don't go for the new paradigm of single mothers. I don't think lesbians make great mothers. I don't think a "couple" can be two homosexuals. I am a traditional sort Newman and I think the best paradigm for a good family is a husband and wife working together.

2. How many families do you know that are in church if the mother isn't? How many are in church if the father isn't?

I know many mothers in church whose families are not. In fact it is more likely that if the father goes the rest of the family will

This isn't to say that women are more powerful; but recognizing that there seems to be some patterns...

What patterns and yes it sure seems some of the posts lately are not just out to help women but rather are biased against men

Hey, maybe its all about who cooks supper and not about gender!

Men usually end up cooking for themselves nowadays now that both are working, or the single mother decides the man is disposable.

But let's talk about it instead of accusing each side of discrimination.

I wasn't the first one to mention discrimination, nor was I the one that suggested Adam wasn't worth the dirt he was made from so Satan attacks the women nor was I the one that suggested families only need a woman not a man. What garbage lol

If you read my posts I say they need BOTH. Im balanced. I said both can be abused and persecuted, not just the woman. I said both are the targets of Satan. Balanced...you see I don't have an agenda to promote males above women nor do I oppose women being treated fairly. I do oppose anything that denigrates males which is often the case when these kinds of discussions come up. Typically people who try to take the side you seem to be on don't know how to have balance. They don't see a middle ground. They are liberals. The people who will take the opposite side and promote the male are probably conservatives more than likely.

The people who realize it's just a trick of Satan to DIVIDE us to take those extreme sides are moderates and we sit here in the middle just shaking our heads at the both of ya.

[Newman]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Yes I also disagree that the moon is made out of green cheese. I don't go for the new paradigm of single mothers. I don't think lesbians make great mothers. I don't think a "couple" can be two homosexuals. I am a traditional sort Newman and I think the best paradigm for a good family is a husband and wife working together.

I know many mothers in church whose families are not. In fact it is more likely that if the father goes the rest of the family will

What patterns and yes it sure seems some of the posts lately are not just out to help women but rather are biased against men

Men usually end up cooking for themselves nowadays now that both are working, or the single mother decides the man is disposable.

I wasn't the first one to mention discrimination, nor was I the one that suggested Adam wasn't worth the dirt he was made from so Satan attacks the women nor was I the one that suggested families only need a woman not a man. What garbage lol

If you read my posts I say they need BOTH. Im balanced. I said both can be abused and persecuted, not just the woman. I said both are the targets of Satan. Balanced...you see I don't have an agenda to promote males above women nor do I oppose women being treated fairly. I do oppose anything that denigrates males which is often the case when these kinds of discussions come up. Typically people who try to take the side you seem to be on don't know how to have balance. They don't see a middle ground. They are liberals. The people who will take the opposite side and promote the male are probably conservatives more than likely.

The people who realize it's just a trick of Satan to DIVIDE us to take those extreme sides are moderates and we sit here in the middle just shaking our heads at the both of ya.

Prax- We are only exploring the issues and looking at many sides of the equation.

1. Case in point... statistics show that there may be alot of mothers rocking cradles, but our prison population is FULL of men who did not have regular contact with or know their father.

So maybe, all the cradle rocking in the world is in vain if dad or someone standing in as a father figure isn't around.

2. My experience is different. I have seen more moms raise kids alone in church than single dads; although some try.

But again, we have an interesting paradox. There may be more single moms in the church trying to raise their kids alone; but when dads are there; so is mom. So who's influence is reaching further?

So you see Prax; there is hope for this thread yet. We just have to dig a little deeper to draw the answers out.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Man this is as dangerous as it gets....families don't need a man. All they need is a woman. Sure. Satan won't try to destroy the man cuz if you want to hurt the family you need to get the woman, not the lowly male. This whole thread ends up being reverse discrimination in disguise!

Satan is after EVERYONE. HE destroys families by working on men and women and teens.

The problem with this thread is it is full of a lot of unfounded assertions geared to stroke the ego of the liberal feminists AND it is very very very unbalanced presenting women as the only pillar in a family satan would want to try to attack and that only women are "persecuted" by men (btw women can be just as evil towards men) and not rather men and women both are corrupt humanity and take advantage over others and that this is the church persecuting women

Prax,

You amaze me. I didn't mean or allude to the assertion you made that families don't need men. Doggoneit Prax...I think just the oposite than that. I will even concede to the fact I need one.

The fact is, in or out of the church, the women by nature are nurturers even of their husbands. And if the woman folds, a man just finds another woman to take her spot because it is very difficult for men and children to survive without a Mom and a wife. But our country is made up of primarily single parent families; women with children & at poverty level. Women and children SURVIVE but just barely.

If you are insinuating that I am a liberal feminist you are out of your ever lovin' mind. My prayer and desire is that our churches be filled with healthy families with a two parent home and a Father that loves his wife, the mother of his children, and children that have respect and honor their parents. It comes from the head down. If the head is dysfunctional then the whole body/family is dysfunctional.

God give us men who don't abuse their position and who cover their families financially, spiritually, and will die for their family's protection.

Sincerely, Rhoni

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Prax,

You amaze me. I didn't mean or allude to the assertion you made that families don't need men. Doggoneit Prax...I think just the oposite than that. I will even concede to the fact I need one.

The fact is, in or out of the church, the women by nature are nurturers even of their husbands. And if the woman folds, a man just finds another woman to take her spot because it is very difficult for men and children to survive without a Mom and a wife. But our country is made up of primarily single parent families; women with children & at poverty level. Women and children SURVIVE but just barely.

If you are insinuating that I am a liberal feminist you are out of your ever lovin' mind. My prayer and desire is that our churches be filled with healthy families with a two parent home and a Father that loves his wife, the mother of his children, and children that have respect and honor their parents. It comes from the head down. If the head is dysfunctional then the whole body/family is dysfunctional.

God give us men who don't abuse their position and who cover their families financially, spiritually, and will die for their family's protection.

Sincerely, Rhoni

Well it sure seems that way Rhoni. Im not trying to insinuate anything. Im reading these posts and I see no balance. I see nothing good about men....all I see is empowerment to the woman and why Satan wants to get at her...because if he does that will destroy the family? That seems rather odd to say. It seems absolute. I have seen many statements here that seem absolute and unbalanced.

Rhoni I apologize if I misunderstood you but please reconsider how you word things in your post. I have seen some disturbing trends in this thread and I have seen the same in this forum. What happens is in order to take one side and present the issues a hyperbole of a sorts is formed...someone ends up playing Devils Advocate to tear down one side usually in a misguided attempt to seem tolerate to the other side. The same thing is happening in race relations all across America. To equal out the races, rather than try to help the one side it really amounts to tearing down the other.

Whites are made the devil incarnate...all of them. No true investigation into that person is made, they are all labeled racists and power hungry etc etc. Our world is becoming polarized into two extremes with no middle balanced ground or no attempt to seek a balance. Every side wants more than a share of the cake, they want the whole thing

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Well it sure seems that way Rhoni. Im not trying to insinuate anything. Im reading these posts and I see no balance. I see nothing good about men....all I see is empowerment to the woman and why Satan wants to get at her...because if he does that will destroy the family? That seems rather odd to say. It seems absolute. I have seen many statements here that seem absolute and unbalanced.

Rhoni I apologize if I misunderstood you but please reconsider how you word things in your post. I have seen some disturbing trends in this thread and I have seen the same in this forum. What happens is in order to take one side and present the issues a hyperbole of a sorts is formed...someone ends up playing Devils Advocate to tear down one side usually in a misguided attempt to seem tolerate to the other side. The same thing is happening in race relations all across America. To equal out the races, rather than try to help the one side it really amounts to tearing down the other.

Whites are made the devil incarnate...all of them. No true investigation into that person is made, they are all labeled racists and power hungry etc etc. Our world is becoming polarized into two extremes with no middle balanced ground or no attempt to seek a balance. Every side wants more than a share of the cake, they want the whole thing

It would appear that our world is confused and tolerance goes too far as well as prejudice and discrimination. American culture is each man for himself and pay no attention who you step on in the process. This is the spirit of the age..the spirit of the anti-christ.

There is more balance than you think on this forum. If people would stop trying to read so much into thoughtless posts. We all see through a glass darkly but one day...

[Sister Alvear]

I lovethe ACTS church where men and women went everywhere preaching the gospel...it was not about big I little you or vise versa it was about JESUS..YAHSHUA...

[Felicity]

Going back to the original post again, any attempt to subjugate and ruin any part of the human race - including women - is devilish and evil.

I don't know much about Tertullian or Augustine but there's no doubt their minds and hearts were twisted to say what they did about women. Of course I'm just going on the quotes offered in the initial post, but reading those posts makes me wonder just exactly what their problem was!! Seems like they had major issues!

Jesus loved women and demonstrated it. He showed no bias. He showed them love and respect, but there is also no doubt that the apostles' teaching lined up with God's plan i.e. that women were to live with and under male leadership and dominance --- dominance in its best definition though. Her role was to be a helpmeet to man. And that was demonstrated many times over throughout scripture. Doesn't mean she can't lead either. Because there are examples of women occupying leadership positions throughout scripture.

Man is commanded by God to love and provide for women and give them proper respect. Of course Satan wants to pervert and destroy God's best intention for women. That's his business. It has always been his business.

[Barb]

Originally Posted by Felicity

Going back to the original post again, any attempt to subjugate and ruin any part of the human race - including women - is devilish and evil.

I don't know much about Tertullian or Augustine but there's no doubt their minds and hearts were twisted to say what they did about women. Of course I'm just going on the quotes offered in the initial post, but reading those posts makes me wonder just exactly what their problem was!!

Jesus loved women and demonstrated it. He showed no bias. He showed them love and respect, but there is also no doubt that the apostles' teaching lined up with God's plan i.e. that women were to live with and under male leadership and dominance --- dominance in its best definition though. Her role was to be a helpmeet to man. And that was demonstrated many times over throughout scripture. Doesn't mean she can't lead either. Because there are examples of women occupying leadership positions throughout scripture.

Man is commanded by God to love and provide for women and give them proper respect. Of course Satan wants to pervert and destroy God's best intention for women. That's his business. It has always been his business.

Yes, I agree.

The literal meaning of helpmeet is a help, answering to him, or one who answers.

My dad had this in his Bible when I was a young'un...

Eve was made out of the side of Adam. Not made out of his head to rule over him, nor out of his feet to be trampled upon by him, but out of his side to be equal with him, under his arm to be protected, and near his heart to be loved.

I remember reading it often and thinking how cool it would be if this were true with everyone everywhere...

[Felicity]

Daniel ........ *sigh*

Was that necessary?

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Felicity

Daniel ........ *sigh*

Was that necessary?

As necessary as his swipe at me ... in which he states:

Daniel, you would defend the devil himself if he registered here and attacked Apostolic doctrine and ministry.