The Effects of A Loud Shout | Raul Alvear Jr. :)

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

He is my son but I personally know he prays hours and hours for great revival and souls...He oversees around 35 daughter works plus many churches in Brazil...his church has over 600 members....I saw him start off with 3 elderly saints....

Im sure he does and that he has great faith. But shouting does nothing

What bible verse are we using? I fear for our movement that we put faith in uncut hair and shouting and not in God

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by CC1

i also scream and yell when I am in pain but don't feel that means I need to scream when worshipping God or speaking. The analogy you used is one I have heard all my life and it is just as lame now as it was 50 years ago.

What I do at a sporting event has absolutely nothing to do with how I should worship. My relationship to God is in no way shape or form anything like my relationship to a football team or any other sporting event. It is extraordinarily shallow to make that comparison but I don't hold you personally responsibile for it since it is a Pentecostal tradition to make that analogy. LOL!!!

I saw somewhere a study that suggests cussing relieves pain....

[KeptByTheWord]

Outward antics never touch the heart of God. They may impress others, but God is looking at the heart.

[J.A. Perez]

2nd Corinthians 7:1
Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

I understand the apostle to explain, that God cares about what is on the inside and what is in the out.

I have found that people are expressive and vocal about that which they care and love most.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto SALVATION.

I love your sister word, but I have to respectfully disagree.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Outward antics never touch the heart of God. They may impress others, but God is looking at the heart.

God looks at both what we DO and WHY we do it.

God commands his people to shout in praise and worship. God also gave us inspired examples of his servants shouting which are approved by him.

There is not one bible verse that says or even suggests real, physical, vocal, auditory worship is ignored by God if the heart is right.

"Blessed are they who know the TERUAH" (joyful sound, KJV). Today is Yom Teruah, the Day of LOUD NOISE-MAKING. IE SHOUTING.

Some folks don't like shouting because they got nothing to shout about.

But Jesus saved me from DEATH AND HELL so YES I'm going to shout!!!!

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by CC1

My relationship to God is in no way shape or form anything like my relationship to a football team or any other sporting event.

Yes, the sporting event excites you enough to make you cheer and shout, but God does not.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by CC1

i also scream and yell when I am in pain but don't feel that means I need to scream when worshipping God or speaking. The analogy you used is one I have heard all my life and it is just as lame now as it was 50 years ago.

What I do at a sporting event has absolutely nothing to do with how I should worship. My relationship to God is in no way shape or form anything like my relationship to a football team or any other sporting event. It is extraordinarily shallow to make that comparison but I don't hold you personally responsibile for it since it is a Pentecostal tradition to make that analogy. LOL!!!

Originally Posted by Esaias

Yes, the sporting event excites you enough to make you cheer and shout, but God does not.

So...really? You believe CC1 is not "excited"? Does the bible say we have to all express "excitement" or express it the same way or with the same volume?

Sadly, in Oneness churches, that has become a measuring stick for the "super spiritual" to judge others. It's gotten so bad in some places, people "run the aisle" just to fit in or not be the odd man out.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez

2nd Corinthians 7:1
Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

I understand the apostle to explain, that God cares about what is on the inside and what is in the out.

I have found that people are expressive and vocal about that which they care and love most.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto SALVATION.

I love your sister word, but I have to respectfully disagree.

Originally Posted by Esaias

God looks at both what we DO and WHY we do it.

God commands his people to shout in praise and worship. God also gave us inspired examples of his servants shouting which are approved by him.

There is not one bible verse that says or even suggests real, physical, vocal, auditory worship is ignored by God if the heart is right.

"Blessed are they who know the TERUAH" (joyful sound, KJV). Today is Yom Teruah, the Day of LOUD NOISE-MAKING. IE SHOUTING.

Some folks don't like shouting because they got nothing to shout about.

But Jesus saved me from DEATH AND HELL so YES I'm going to shout!!!!

You both misunderstood me. I said "Outward antics never touch the heart of God. They may impress others but He looks at the heart." I did not say one should not be expressive in praise and worship to God -- how silly is that! David danced before the Lord. Many, many examples of outward worship in scripture, with the heart right in the eyes of God.

My point was... many just do the outward antics hoping that is enough to please God. It's not. Hope I cleared the confusion

And for the record... I love to praise the Lord, lift my voice in song, and worship... and what a beautiful thing it is. But, simply screaming, shouting, and carrying on, without true heartfelt worship is something that God will never accept.

He wants our worship with our hearts connected in praise and adoration to Him.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

So...really? You believe CC1 is not "excited"? Does the bible say we have to all express "excitement" or express it the same way or with the same volume?

Sadly, in Oneness churches, that has become a measuring stick for the "super spiritual" to judge others. It's gotten so bad in some places, people "run the aisle" just to fit in or not be the odd man out.

Yes, these kind of "antics" is what I was thinking of, as I grew up in a church where that was how spirituality was measured, by how high the shout, or how many aisles you ran, or how many hours you shouted/danced. A service wasn't considered a "high one" until the count of bobby pins on the floor was made... lol!

If our hearts are not right -- and God is the righteous judge of this -- but fruit of the spirit in our lives will be evidence as well -- then those kind of antics don't make you more holy or saved.

[Sister Alvear]

Ezra 3:11-13 ESV /

And they sang responsively, praising and giving thanks to the Lord, “For he is good, for his steadfast love endures forever toward Israel.” And all the people shouted with a great shout when they praised the Lord, because the foundation of the house of the Lord was laid. But many of the priests and Levites and heads of fathers' houses, old men who had seen the first house, wept with a loud voice when they saw the foundation of this house being laid, though many shouted aloud for joy, so that the people could not distinguish the sound of the joyful shout from the sound of the people's weeping, for the people shouted with a great shout, and the sound was heard far away.

Luke 19:37-41 ESV /

As he was drawing near—already on the way down the Mount of Olives—the whole multitude of his disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen, saying, “Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven and glory in the highest!” And some of the Pharisees in the crowd said to him, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples.” He answered, “I tell you, if these were silent, the very stones would cry out.” And when he drew near and saw the city, he wept over it,

Revelation 5:12-14 ESV /

Saying with a loud voice, “Worthy is the Lamb who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and might and honor and glory and blessing!” And I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and in the sea, and all that is in them, saying, “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be blessing and honor and glory and might forever and ever!” And the four living creatures said, “Amen!” and the elders fell down and worshiped.

Psalm 98:4 ESV /

Make a joyful noise to the Lord, all the earth; break forth into joyous song and sing praises!

Luke 17:15 ESV /

Then one of them, when he saw that he was healed, turned back, praising God with a loud voice;

Psalm 47:1 ESV /

To the choirmaster. A Psalm of the Sons of Korah. Clap your hands, all peoples! Shout to God with loud songs of joy!

Isaiah 12:6 ESV /

Shout, and sing for joy, O inhabitant of Zion, for great in your midst is the Holy One of Israel.”

Zephaniah 3:14-15 ESV /

Sing aloud, O daughter of Zion; shout, O Israel! Rejoice and exult with all your heart, O daughter of Jerusalem! The Lord has taken away the judgments against you; he has cleared away your enemies. The King of Israel, the Lord, is in your midst; you shall never again fear evil.

Psalm 100:1-5 ESV /

A Psalm for giving thanks. Make a joyful noise to the Lord, all the earth! Serve the Lord with gladness! Come into his presence with singing! Know that the Lord, he is God! It is he who made us, and we are his; we are his people, and the sheep of his pasture. Enter his gates with thanksgiving, and his courts with praise! Give thanks to him; bless his name! For the Lord is good; his steadfast love endures forever, and his faithfulness to all generations.

Psalm 150:1-6 ESV /

Praise the Lord! Praise God in his sanctuary; praise him in his mighty heavens! Praise him for his mighty deeds; praise him according to his excellent greatness! Praise him with trumpet sound; praise him with lute and harp! Praise him with tambourine and dance; praise him with strings and pipe! Praise him with sounding cymbals; praise him with loud clashing cymbals! ...