"washing of water by the word" Ephesians 5;25 - 27

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by RonMurray

Ephesians 5;25 - 27.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, 26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, 27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.

Key Phrase: "washing of water by the word".

Key Word: "word".

"word" = rhema.


The Word of God: Logos and Rhema

"There are two primary Greek words that describe Scripture which are translated word in the New Testament. The first, logos, refers principally to the total inspired Word of God and to Jesus, Who is the living Logos."

"The second primary Greek word that describes Scripture is rhema, which refers to a word that is spoken and means “an utterance.” A rhema is a verse or portion of Scripture that the Holy Spirit brings to our attention with application to a current situation or need for direction."

--- "Advanced Training Institute International"


In Ephesians 5;25 & 26, it says that Christ loved the church and gave Himself for her, that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word. And where it says, "washing of water by the word", some people will say that this isn't referring to baptism, and explain that water here is referring to the word, because it says " by the word". But how are we baptized by the word? By applying that word of baptism, like in Acts 2;38, where it says, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

The term "word" here in the Greek is "rhema", which means a specific word that's applied to a specifc need or situatuation. So it's talking about being washed by water by the word of baptism, or by the message, or instruction, or command, of baptism. 
.

This verse has to do with cleansing the church (those who have already been baptized) and not unbelievers coming to the obedience of the faith in baptism, in my opinion.

[RonMurray]

Believers together as a body are the church. It's talking about all the believers together as a whole, as the body of Christ, the church.

The term "word" is "rhema", which means a word that's applied. Washing of water by the word means actively applying water as intructed or commanded by a word in scripture. This is referring to the act of washing of water, meaning being baptized with water.

And in Jewish culture, the woman prepares for her mariage to the groom by bathing, and she had to be immersed completely under water, and takes on the name of groom before they're married. Baptism is a washig of the church in preparation for her marriage to Christ. And we take on the Lord's name by baptism in the name of Jesus.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by RonMurray

Believers together as a body are the church. It's talking about all the believers together as a whole, as the body of Christ, the church.

The term "word" is "rhema", which means a word that's applied. Washing of water by the word means actively applying water as intructed or commanded by a word in scripture. This is referring to the act of washing of water, meaning being baptized with water.

And in Jewish culture, the woman prepares for her mariage to the groom by bathing, and she had to be immersed completely under water, and takes on the name of groom before they're married. Baptism is a washig of the church in preparation for her marriage to Christ. And we take on the Lord's name by baptism in the name of Jesus.

If this verse is written to the church, to people who have already been water baptized, then according to your interpretation every time a saint sins they must be water baptized.

The word can symbolize washing with water the outer body because when the word is received by a believer (someone who is part of the church) it works toward bringing them to repentance. When we repent, God forgives us according to 1 John 1:9.

The word that Paul sent in his epistle to the Corinthians caused this very thing to happen. The word was an instrument/agency through which a result came, "by the word". The word did not literally wash them or cleanse them for the applied blood of Jesus does that.

For though I made you sorry with a letter, I do not repent, though I did repent: for I perceive that the same epistle hath made you sorry, though it were but for a season.

2 Cor 7:9 Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.

10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter

.

If we are to understand the Ephesian's passage as speaking to water baptism ( which I suppose you could) how would Christ be able to present to himself a pure church (a church without sin) if they continue to sin after their initial water baptism unless there was a way to forgive sin without having to be repeated water baptized every time we sin?

[RonMurray]

Originally Posted by mizpeh

If this verse is written to the church, to people who have already been water baptized, then according to your interpretation every time a saint sins they must be water baptized.

The word can symbolize washing with water the outer body because when the word is received by a believer (someone who is part of the church) it works toward bringing them to repentance. When we repent, God forgives us according to 1 John 1:9.

The word that Paul sent in his epistle to the Corinthians caused this very thing to happen. The word was an instrument/agency through which a result came, "by the word". The word did not literally wash them or cleanse them for the applied blood of Jesus does that.

For though I made you sorry with a letter, I do not repent, though I did repent: for I perceive that the same epistle hath made you sorry, though it were but for a season.

.

If we are to understand the Ephesian's passage as speaking to water baptism ( which I suppose you could) how would Christ be able to present to himself a pure church (a church without sin) if they continue to sin after their initial water baptism unless there was a way to forgive sin without having to be repeated water baptized every time we sin?

You're reading the scripture wrong. It's not telling them they need to be washed by water by the wotd, you're saying the same thing you just accused me of saying. Because the church had already been washed and cleansed.

It says, "that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, that he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish". Ephesians 5:26 & 27.

It's explaining that the church had been washed by water by the word, not needs to be. That's how we become a part of the body of Christ, by repentance, baptism, and receiving the Holy Spirit. And it's explaining why we're washed with water by the word, by rhema, by the act of applying water. It's so Jesus coulld present us to Himself "a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish". \0/

[Esaias]

And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD unto Jerusalem; Thy birth and thy nativity is of the land of Canaan; thy father was an Amorite, and thy mother an Hittite. And as for thy nativity, in the day thou wast born thy navel was not cut, neither wast thou washed in water to supple thee; thou wast not salted at all, nor swaddled at all. None eye pitied thee, to do any of these unto thee, to have compassion upon thee; but thou wast cast out in the open field, to the lothing of thy person, in the day that thou wast born. And when I passed by thee, and saw thee polluted in thine own blood, I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live; yea, I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live. I have caused thee to multiply as the bud of the field, and thou hast increased and waxen great, and thou art come to excellent ornaments: thy breasts are fashioned, and thine hair is grown, whereas thou wast naked and bare. Now when I passed by thee, and looked upon thee, behold, thy time was the time of love; and I spread my skirt over thee, and covered thy nakedness: yea, I sware unto thee, and entered into a covenant with thee, saith the Lord GOD, and thou becamest mine. Then washed I thee with water; yea, I throughly washed away thy blood from thee, and I anointed thee with oil. I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk. I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck. And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head. Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom. And thy renown went forth among the heathen for thy beauty: for it was perfect through my comeliness, which I had put upon thee, saith the Lord GOD.
(Ezekiel 16:3-14)

[shazeep]

well, one might apply water symbolically as in church baptism and be correct, surely, don't get me wrong, but it was in seeking a meaning for baptism by "fire" that may lead one back to people, and one's interactions with them. If you will accept it, there is a sense in which water baptism's importance may be revealed in the passage "...but He will baptize you with the Spirit and with fire," noting that Christ was yet baptized with water, albeit with a rather interesting remark that seems to indicate that it was symbolic, for a public declaration.

Also, 3You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you should be considered, wherein no water seems to have been involved, although one must reflect upon what "word" was spoken to them, but it had to have been signifying this "water" or Spirit, so it would seem to verify the interpretation of water as Spirit, while discounting actual immersion in water, which is still an important symbol.

so not to discount immersion in water, but i have trouble seeing it as the be-all end-all of baptism, and i have become convinced that there will be those "accepted" who never participated in the immersion ritual.

[mfblume]

Jesus gave himself for the church. that's his death. he laid down his life to have a church. like Adam who slept so God could make a wide from his side.

And he washed us in baptism into that death which is only efficacious by our faith in the word. It's about conversion. becoming the bride.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by RonMurray

You're right that we don't have to believe that water in John 3:5 is referring to batism to believe we must be baptized, because there's plenty of other scriptures. But if we want the correct interpretation of that verse and preach the truth, then, yes, we do have to believe and preach that.

The water and Spirit in John 3:5 is the same as the water and Spirit mentioned in 1 John 5:8, that I mentioned before. The blood, water, and Spirit are directly connected with repentance, baptism, and the gift of the Holy Spirit. The blood of Christ is applied in repentance, water is applied in baptism, and the Spirit is applied by the infilling of the Holy Spirit.

Just like in Romans 6:3 - 6 and 8:11, where it talks about the believer being crucified, buried, and resurrected with Christ through repentance, baptism, and the infilling of the Holy Spirit. See the connection between all these?

Repentance = Death
Baptism = Burial
Holy Spirit = Resurrection

Also...

Repentamce = Blood
Baptism = Water
Holy Spirit = Spirit

We could put them all together...

Repentance = Death = Blood
Baptism = Burial = Water
Holy Spirit = Resurrection = Spirit

I was taught these things by divine revelation and teaching from God by His Spirit. These are the teachings of God. This is apostolic teaching.

If you want to know the truth for yourself, go to God about it, and ask God to let you know if these things are true or not.

I went to God before and asked Him to let me know if it's true that everyone who receives the Holy Spirit will speak in tongues, and if it's true that He's Jesus, and if God wanted every believer to be baptized in the name of Jesus, or if it didn't matter. And God showed me in His word, and gave me divine revelation and understanding of those versrs, and confirmed it to and made me know that it's true, that everyone who receives the Holy Spirit will speak in tongues, and that He is Jesus, that Jesus and God atre one in the same, and that it is the will of God for every believer to baptized in the name of Jesus. And I cpntinued on by praying and asking God to teach me more about salvation, and trach me more about the things in the Bible that's connected with Acts 2:38, because I wanted to learn as much as I could about it, and I asjed God to give me a spirit of revelation and give me knowledge, wisdom, and understanding, and teach me His word and His ways in general.

And God showed me and taught me a lot by His Spirit. So I encpurage you to do the same. That's why I gave the specifics of what I prayed, so you could do thr same. After asking God to let you know if those things are true or not, also pray and ask God to give you a spirit of revelation, and give you knowledge, wisdom, and understanding, to teach you His word and His ways.

it doesn't follow that death is repentance and burial is Baptism and resurrection is Spirit Baptism. The gentiles got the Spirit before they were baptized. how can you resurrect before you're buried and then get buried after you resurrected?

and I disagree with the saying that God can violate his own rules if he wants.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by mfblume

it doesn't follow that death is repentance and burial is Baptism and resurrection is Spirit Baptism. The gentiles got the Spirit before they were baptized. how can you resurrect before you're buried and then get buried after you resurrected?

and I disagree with the saying that God can violate his own rules if he wants.

This brings up a question: If resurrection occurs in baptism (Paul says it does) then where does being born of the Spirit fit in to the new life/resurrection paradigm? This is why many think the Spirit is received in baptism and is distinct from the Pentecostal experience.

[FlamingZword]

Here is my response from my book "The original Matthew 28:19 Restored".

5). Ephesians 5:26 - “That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word”
I am going to go out on a limb out there and make the case that Ephesians 5 Verse 26 is a veiled reference to baptism in the name of Jesus. When we read it in other versions, we can see that it refers to baptism.
NIV. “to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word”
Noyes. “that he might sanctify it, having cleansed it by the bath of the water in the word”
Goodspeed. “to consecrate her, after cleansing her with the bath in water through her confession of him”
Name of God Bible. He did this to make the church holy by cleansing it, washing it using water along with spoken words.
Weymouth. “in order to make her holy, cleansing her with the baptismal water by the word,”
Living Bible. to make her holy and clean, washed by baptism and God’s Word;

Expanded Bible. 26 to •make her holy [sanctify her], cleansing her in the washing of water by the word [C the “washing” may be (1) baptism, (2) spiritual cleansing (Titus 3:5), or (3) an analogy drawn from the Jewish prenuptial bath (Ezek. 16:8–14); the “word” may be (1) the Gospel, (2) a baptismal formula, or (3) the confession of the one baptized].

In Ephesians 5:26 the Greek term employed for washing is loutro. The same word is used in Acts 22:16, as noted earlier: "Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins." In this Acts account Baptism and washing away sins are synonymous. Louo means to wash, bathe." A. Oepke in the Theological Dictionary states that in many instances, this "is a clear reference to baptism. On the basis of this meaning of and usage of the terms cleansing and washing away of sins, we may rightly conclude that Ephesians 5:26 is a clear reference to baptism. Baptism: God's Activity of Grace (2006) p. 42 by Doctor Morris Vaagenes.
As some may see and understand that this is really a reference to baptism as the initial rite of initiation into the body of Christ. Other ministers have also made the argument that this verse refers to baptism in a symbolic way. However I propose that the next part is a symbolic or cryptic reference to the name of Jesus, for he is “the word.” (his name is the Word of God, Rev 19:13) I propose that this is a veiled reference that the name of Jesus was pronounced at baptism. For it is by the name of Jesus we are washed and cleansed from all sins; for it is through the name of Jesus that we attain salvation; for it is in his name that we are sanctified and saved.