Planned Destruction of Civilisation - Page 3

Esaias · #21 03-24-2019, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

You mentioned a very powerful point to another poster in the Matthew 28:19 thread. It was concerning the love for a wife. Let me give my opinion on that post. A man gets news that his wife committed adultery. Instead of guilty until proven innocent, his love for his wife inpowers him to do everything to find the truth. We are in love with Jesus Christ, not a doctrine, not an organization, church fellowship, or group. We love Him because He loved us first. Our love for Him is to please Him, even if it costs us everything we own. People at times may think our love is too excessive, and precise that we aren't being given the same amount of love as we are giving out. But we know our love for Jesus Christ can never be enough, because we understand what He does for us on the daily. Follow me as I follow Christ, the apostle told his church family. Jesus sets the example of righteousness. No matter what goes on in this amazingly crippled world in which we live. We must hold on to the works which are created through Jesus Christ's Grace towards us. We can do all things through Christ who makes us strong.

Esaias · #22 03-24-2019, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Esaias,

I agree with what you are teaching here. Very few Churches have this kind of vision. Yet I dont see how ALSO teaching what the Bible DOES say about having an endtime mindset is wrong.

Remember the New Testament was given to conquered people, living under nations with no Constitution and no democracy. They had no freedom to attend civic meetings and spread the gospel.

They DID embrace the law of Christ and put him above all else. The Apostles seemed to have taught them to live in full obedience to Christ and submit (when possible) to the kings and governers of their lands.

They were to live as the children of light in a dark world who had a desire and love for the coming of Jesus again to bring their "full" salvation.

The problem is what is the "proper Biblical end time mind set"?

From what I can see in Scripture, the basic mind set is to be busy doing what the Lord instructed us to be doing. If however a person is convinced the end of all things is most likely going to occur within say ten or twenty years, there is a whole slew of things they AREN'T going to be busy doing.

Like having kids. How many MILLIONS of people have chosen not to have kids, or not to have "any more" than the 1.5 they statistically have, because the end is coming soon so what would be the point?

How many people have literally just given up on influencing the society around them because "it will get worse and worse and then the end shall come"? I can't count how many conversations I've had with believers (including pastors) whose "end time mindset" has neutralised them and their fellow believers.

Evang.Benincasa · #23 03-24-2019, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ehud

I doubt his issue is reading comprehension, but rather how you have phrased your position. I don't think you would get any argument about not bowing to idols if the state said to do so, but your wording implies the apostles taught some watered down version of obeying civil authorities. I, too, can think of no place this occurred and would love to see an example because I have no doubt I could be missing something.

Sometimes we take for granted that we are 'obviously not talking about that' -- whatever that may be -- but to those skimming and reviewing your post, I can see how one could misunderstand what you have said. "And when possible" could mean many different things to many different people.

Evang.Benincasa · #24 03-24-2019, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I said the Apostles taught to obey Jesus and when possible to obey the state. You seem to be grasping to find something, anything to disagree with.

No Mike, you aren't the victim, so don't don the sack cloth.
The idea of obey if possible isn't ever presented in the scripture. What we are to do is spelled out quite nicely in these following scriptures Proverbs 8:15, Proverbs 24:21, Daniel 2:21, Daniel 4:17, John 19:11, Romans 13:1, 1 Timothy 2:2, Titus 3:1, and 1 Peter 2:13. The Apostle Paul was not only a good within the law of Moses, but he was also a good Roman. He used the Roman law to enable him to travel under protection from the Judeans who wanted to kill him. There isn't anything about submit to higher powers as much as possible. If we are going to go rounds and rounds with a brother over whether Matthew 28:19 in its original form is legit. Why would I mot ask you to clarify yourself on this?

Evang.Benincasa · #25 03-24-2019, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esaias

The problem is what is the "proper Biblical end time mind set"?

From what I can see in Scripture, the basic mind set is to be busy doing what the Lord instructed us to be doing. If however a person is convinced the end of all things is most likely going to occur within say ten or twenty years, there is a whole slew of things they AREN'T going to be busy doing.

Like having kids. How many MILLIONS of people have chosen not to have kids, or not to have "any more" than the 1.5 they statistically have, because the end is coming soon so what would be the point?

How many people have literally just given up on influencing the society around them because "it will get worse and worse and then the end shall come"? I can't count how many conversations I've had with believers (including pastors) whose "end time mindset" has neutralised them and their fellow believers.

Super clean post.

Esaias · #26 03-24-2019, 02:24 PM

EVERYTHING must be conformed to the Word of God, so that it is no longer you living your life, but Christ living His life in and through you.

This is the seldom preached and seldom understood doctrine of God-Manifestation.

Your purpose is God-Manifestation. Your purpose is to be a walking, talking, living manifestation of the nature, character, power, and presence of Almighty God. THIS is how God has chosen to reveal Himself to the nations of mankind. And you are called to be a part of that programme of Divine Revelation.

When we grasp this concept of our actual purpose and calling, we're ready for phase 2, the reformation of our families. Your family likewise has a purpose here on this earth. And as a Christian, it is your duty to spread the Word to your family that THEY ARE PART OF THE TRUE GOSPEL MISSION. They have a purpose, not just as individuals, but as a family unit.

The family must, as a collective unit, be reformed after a godly fashion, to function as part of the ARMY OF THE LORD. See, God is Lord of Sabaoth, Lord of HOSTS. a host is an army, and armies are divided into units. An army is not just a mass of individuals (that would just be a mob). It is instead individuals grouped in units, and the first unit beyond the individual is the family.

Israel was called the Lord's hosts or armies (Ex 12:41), and the Passover lamb was to be selected "according to your families" (Ex 12:21). Thus, the Redemption of the hosts of the Lord was by families. We see this repeated in Acts 11:14 and Acts 16:3. The family is the basic unit of God's army.

The family then, as a basic unit of the Lord's hosts, must be on the same page, operating TOGETHER under the Commander's intent (the Gospel). The manual is the Bible. Each member of the family should be taking steps to help the family advance God's Dominion and Rule (Kingdom).

Granted, today, most families are a wreck, not on the same page at all. But you gotta start somewhere. Run what ya brung. Wherever your family is, whatever condition it's in, salvage what you can and move forward. TALK TO THEM ABOUT THEIR DIVINE DESTINY. Seek ways to build cohesion in the service of God.

Evang.Benincasa · #27 03-24-2019, 03:00 PM

Moving forward towards the mark the high calling in Christ Jesus. No matter how the family is doing someone has to be the bigger kid in the sand box. Working with them so they are able to escape in the Body of Christ the devastation. The barbarians aren't just at the gate, they are in the home, the church, and the job. When the Visigoths sacked Rome on August 24 410 AD, they were let in through the gates. Because they already had fans. The United States is hemorrhaging. Our society is godless, lawless, and immersed in perversion. She affects the entire world as she goes down to the mat. When the United States has a cold, the rest of the world is in bed with the flu. This culture attacked the family in the 60s and 70s. Now gender isn't binary? Good grief. Meanwhile we are seeing all this and saying we can't change it, no endtime revivals for this crowd. Just watch it burn and wait for the Peace Train.

Michael The Disciple · #28 03-24-2019, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esaias

The problem is what is the "proper Biblical end time mind set"?

From what I can see in Scripture, the basic mind set is to be busy doing what the Lord instructed us to be doing. If however a person is convinced the end of all things is most likely going to occur within say ten or twenty years, there is a whole slew of things they AREN'T going to be busy doing.

Like having kids. How many MILLIONS of people have chosen not to have kids, or not to have "any more" than the 1.5 they statistically have, because the end is coming soon so what would be the point?

How many people have literally just given up on influencing the society around them because "it will get worse and worse and then the end shall come"? I can't count how many conversations I've had with believers (including pastors) whose "end time mindset" has neutralised them and their fellow believers.

An end time mindset.

1 Peter 1:13-16

13Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; 14As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance: 15But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; 16Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

Hope to the end....for the grace coming at the revelation of Jesus Christ. IN THE MEANTIME live in obedience to him which includes the great commission, witnessing and teaching the commandments of Christ.

The Apostle taught the disciples the end of all things is at hand.

1 Peter 1:7

7But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

BELIEVE YOU ARE IN THE ENDTIME. Watch and pray as if you are.

2 Peter 3:11-13

11Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Trying to influence society to me is under the heading of separating our lives to God in keeping his words and walking as he walked.

Modern parents who use birth control pills to keep from having children need Biblical teaching on who opens and closes the womb.

"Believers" who are not trying to influence society are basically disobedient believers. Just by obeying Christ you will be influencing the world in which you live.

Nevertheless I see far more in scripture that teaches the world in general will not repent and will wind up hating Christians of every nation. Saints who are suffering for their faith will be more excited about Jesus coming and his kingdom than those who are not suffering

I am not saying dont try to influence the world. I am saying God has a strategy for doing so. Its there in his commandments and instructions. These should be taught and practiced by every saint.

Esaias · #29 03-24-2019, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

An end time mindset.

1 Peter 1:13-16

13Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; 14As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance: 15But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; 16Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

Hope to the end....for the grace coming at the revelation of Jesus Christ. IN THE MEANTIME live in obedience to him which includes the great commission, witnessing and teaching the commandments of Christ.

The Apostle taught the disciples the end of all things is at hand.

1 Peter 1:7

7But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

BELIEVE YOU ARE IN THE ENDTIME. Watch and pray as if you are.

2 Peter 3:11-13

11Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Trying to influence society to me is under the heading of separating our lives to God in keeping his words and walking as he walked.

Modern parents who use birth control pills to keep from having children need Biblical teaching on who opens and closes the womb.

"Believers" who are not trying to influence society are basically disobedient believers. Just by obeying Christ you will be influencing the world in which you live.

Nevertheless I see far more in scripture that teaches the world in general will not repent and will wind up hating Christians of every nation. Saints who are suffering for their faith will be more excited about Jesus coming and his kingdom than those who are not suffering

I am not saying dont try to influence the world. I am saying God has a strategy for doing so. Its their in his commandments and instructions. These should be taught and practiced by every saint.

That last part, bolded, is something I am glad we can agree on.