All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I see you named your sources where he just said believe me.

LOL! Did you read His sources? That's real scholarship? LOL!!

This 'real scholarship' is why you're embarrassing yourself by claiming the middle voice teaches that it was Ananias confessing the name of the Lord on Paul's behalf while Paul just stood there silent receiving salvation through the righteous act of another man ( Ananias, not Christ). As I pointed out to rdp, you only have to get you one of those funny fish hats and turn your collar around backward and you'd fit right in to the Romanist teaching that another man's salvation hinges on what you say, or do not say, on his behalf while immersing him.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by seekerman

LOL! Did you read His sources? That's real scholarship? LOL!!

This 'real scholarship' is why you're embarrassing yourself by claiming the middle voice teaches that it was Ananias confessing the name of the Lord on Paul's behalf while Paul just stood there silent receiving salvation through the righteous act of another man ( Ananias, not Christ). As I pointed out to rdp, you only have to get you one of those funny fish hats and turn your collar around backward and you'd fit right in to the Romanist teaching that another man's salvation hinges on what you say, or do not say, on his behalf while immersing him.

If I read any sources I would have to read his since you quoted none?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by seekerman

If you wish to base your salvation on the actions of another man, go for it. Your confession is worthless to you, it's the confession of another man on your behalf is what saves you..

He that is baptized agrees to submit to baptism in Jesus name, just as he agrees to repent.

It's the repentants faith he repents and the baptizee's faith when he submits

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Scripture teaches that it's the person being baptized speaking the words, not some goober who calls himself a preacher or bishop or some such thing intoning proper words in some sort of modified Romanist ritual of baptismal regeneration.

Act 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Additionally, water isn't the redemptive element of the individual, the blood of the Lamb is. The blood of the Lamb is something that oneness Pentecostals seldom mention when speaking of salvation though. It's almost always the holy oneness trinity of tongues, water baptism with a man saying the proper words over the individual and a list of standards. Where is the blood, the cross, the sacrifice of the Lamb, the perfect High Priest in oneness pentecostal salvation theology. Alas, it all takes a back seat to tongues and baptism and standards most of the time.

While I agree some are guilty of this, it has been my experience that the vast majority are not guilty of this. In fact, the most powerful sermons on the blood and grace that I've heard have been in UPC pulpits.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Originalist

While I agree some are guilty of this, it has been my experience that the vast majority are not guilty of this. In fact, the most powerful sermons on the blood and grace that I've heard have been in UPC pulpits.

I have never been UPC but in my experience in the church Calvary-the blood-redemption has been a constant theme. I make no apologies of being a blood preacher and have been all my years of preaching.

[deacon blues]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Well, I see that there was no scripture forthcoming that supports the idea that one must believe Jesus is God in order to be redeemed/saved. The claim that one must do that is a false claim, has no scriptural basis, and has nothing to do with redemption/salvation.

Here's a good salvation scripture which the majority of oneness Pentecostals reject, claiming that it's a scripture on how to keep being saved or some such bunk.

Rom 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Notice, there is no requirement that one need to believe that Jesus is God in the scripture to be saved. One is required to believe in one's heart that God raised Him (Jesus) from the dead though....per scripture.

I quoted several passages.

I see you didn't answer my question. Can you believe that Jesus isn't God and be saved?

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by deacon blues

I quoted several passages.

I see you didn't answer my question. Can you believe that Jesus isn't God and be saved?

Sorry, didn't mean to ignore the question. Yes, I believe that one can believe that Jesus isn't God and be saved. As I said before, there's no scripture which teaches that one must believe Jesus is God to be saved. John 8:24 is usually the response scripture but that has nothing to do with one having to believe that Jesus is God to be saved.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I have never been UPC but in my experience in the church Calvary-the blood-redemption has been a constant theme. I make no apologies of being a blood preacher and have been all my years of preaching.

Is the blood sufficient for redemption?

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Is the blood sufficient for redemption?

Can one experience the blood without faith and repentance?

[navygoat1998]