Apostolic Summit - Tulsa, OK - Pastors are now receiving it.

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Originally Posted by pelathais

100 Degrees and 100 percent humidity. 'nuf said.

I remember one of the female students upset when all the other females working at Sears took pity on you and gave you a ride......

Same one upset that I was younger that she was!

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

As a young person, I always had a problem with the "unwritten" rules.

For instance, it was just fine to have the latest model of automobile, with all the bells and whistles, it was just fine to wear fancy, expensive suits with silk ties, it was just fine for the women to dress up like they were going to the Queen's ball, you could live in a fancy house, but yet you couldn't wear a wedding ring!

I've never quite understood why our Articles of Faith have absolutely NO wording about facial hair, but if a man grew a mustache, he was backslidden. Unless, of course, it was Christmas/Easter play time, and the beard and mustache were fake. If it's a sin, isn't it a sin to fake it too?

I couldn't understand why we couldn't have TV or go to the "picture show", but it was ok to bring a 16mm projector into the church and show the "End Time" movies.

Couldn't understand why it was wrong to play sports in school, but it was fine to get the whole church group together to fight it out on the football field on a Sunday afternoon. Of course, some of our best services on a Sunday night were caused by the young men repenting for beating the tar out of each other and cussing on the field that afternoon!

In case any hasn't noticed, one of my hobby horses is the propogation of incosistencies in the way we were raised, and I apologize if I'm being a "Bore", lol. (For those of you who read the UPCI Needs a Healer thread, you'll know what I reference)

POTD

[JaneEyre]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Kutless does bring up a problem that is very prevalent among OPs' and in particular at the Bible Colleges.

Whole Hearted you say he didn't "follow the rules..." Was there really a rule that stated he could not have a hair cut in the fashion of WT Witherspoon? I doubt that. In stead someone who either had authority or had simply assumed authority went to Kutless's "girlfriend" and told her to tell Kutless that the "Witherspoon" look is now out and he could not participate in the ensemble thing.

Most of the "rules" that are brought up in these scenarios are not written down but represent someone's knee jerk reaction. It's very unfair to expect eveyone to somehow anticipate whatever new rule might be invented on the fly. The only way to really get a group of people to automatically clone themselves to your whimisical standards is to inculcate an atmosphere of intimidation, bullying and fear.

Kutless's experience reminds me of my Bible School experience. The only "rules" I ever had a problem with were the often contradictory ones that were introduced anew every couple of weeks. One guy goes out and gets a dressy leather jacket- oops, there's now a rule against wearing leather jackets of any kind on campus. A couple of guys get skinny ties like Stanley Chambers wore in the 50's - oops, no skinny ties. The list goes on.

There's something terribly wrong with an environment where you have to guess what is going to offend some pea brain. To resist that culture is NOT rebellion! It's really a form of true holiness. A very practical application of holiness and a demonstration of godliness on the part of the guys with the skinny ties or the "Witherspoon" haitcuts. It's the innovators- those who feel their whimsical "rules" need to be enforced who are in rebellion against God and against holiness.

I am conservative but I have to agree with most of what pelathais posts...

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by BoredOutOfMyMind

I remember one of the female students upset when all the other females working at Sears took pity on you and gave you a ride......

Same one upset that I was younger that she was!

I think you bumped your head there good buddy.

None of "the females" ever took "pity" on me. I might have gotten a date sometime before I reached 30, otherwise.

The one that was "upset" with you probably still is, but she didn't have a car at the time.

[Raven]

Since we are growing nostalgic with our Bible School reminiscing ........ I remember a time on choir tour that the girls ran out of nylons, that according to rules had to have a seam. When nothing but seamless [worldly] could be found the girls had to go to a drug store and buy eyebrow pencils and draw a line up the back of their legs. Of course if they had put any on their eyebrows they would have been sent home! "Consistency thou art a jewel!"
Raven

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

My family has been this wonderful oneness truth since 1925. I have many old photos and my family have always looked like holiness people. I knew my great grandparents personally and they never lied to me.

I have heard many wonderful stories of the past and the standards that were preached and keep. These have been passed to me and I am passing them to my children.

To call the elders lairs is a very serious offence. I thank God for my good elders.

The "holiness look" varies today from church to church and from area to area. It varied that same way back then. There have been some old timers who were very strict about clothing styles and colors and other old timers were not. We can see old pictures of some very straight laced old timers and we can also see pictures of other old timers with jewelry, facial hair on men, and short hair on women. It's just the diversity within this Pentecostal, Apostolic, Holiness movement.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by timlan2057

orward."
...
So now "truth" has hardened and crystallized into whatever a group of preachers mostly around east Texas and southern and central California say it is, eh?

Right!!!
and it's about time you received that revelation!!!

Just some questions needing answers?

If we are unsure of the purpose of this meeting in Tulsa, then why go?

Could someone with influence who is participating in this be from Tulsa?

Why go with either organization? shouldn't we just form our own?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

My family has been this wonderful oneness truth since 1925. I have many old photos and my family have always looked like holiness people. I knew my great grandparents personally and they never lied to me.

I have heard many wonderful stories of the past and the standards that were preached and keep. These have been passed to me and I am passing them to my children.

To call the elders lairs is a very serious offence. I thank God for my good elders.

Indeed, thank God for good elders. And what you describe appears to be a wonderful heritage. However it's not the same experience nor the same heritage as others have had. The "old photos" that I've seen show a great diversity in holiness standards. Women wearing slacks when involved in outdoors activities and with cut in and modest jewelry.

Not everyone grew up near Spindletop. From a North American perspective your experience, though deep and rich, may also be somewhat parochial.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Indeed, thank God for good elders. And what you describe appears to be a wonderful heritage. However it's not the same experience nor the same heritage as others have had. The "old photos" that I've seen show a great diversity in holiness standards. Women wearing slacks when involved in outdoors activities and with cut in and modest jewelry.

Not everyone grew up near Spindletop. From a North American perspective your experience, though deep and rich, may also be somewhat parochial.

Like one of the four blind men who when asked to describe an elephant, said it was long and thin, like a rope -from only feeling its tail.