Sit Down and Behave Yourself!

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Pragmatist

I guess for me it just seems very shallow. I don't deny anyone their experience worshiping God, but I don't think it has much impact beyond that service. I've seen too many people shout and dance on Sunday and not act like a Christian at all the rest of the week. What good does the emotion and "power" do if it doesn't really change someone? I don't think shouting services make people better Christians, so really, what is the point? (And I used to enjoy a good "shockamoo" service but it still felt shallow to me, even in the midst of it.)

Originally Posted by deltaguitar

I don't see anything in this clip that makes me think the Holy Spirit is anywhere around. It is just fast music and frantic behavior at a pace that releases chemicals in the brain that result in folks having a fit.

Now, you might ask what is wrong with having a fit. Well, isn't one of the signs that the Holy Spirit is in our hearts is that we have self-control? I don't see any self control being encourage here. Shouldn't church assembly be done in order and with self sacrifice for the sinner who may be in the midst.

Even the leader of the song knows it is just a joke. If everyone would have sat down and behaved themselves they would have then been reprimanded for not getting in the spirit.

There is nothing wrong with dancing for joy but lets not make it something more than what it is. It is just dancing and having a fit.

JD, if I could say this, I think that maybe your soul is craving something that you think you need. I know, I was raised this way and it was very hard for me to not have the emotional release every service. But now, being in God's presence is so much sweeter and rich and is not about my selfish needs.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Take into consideration that during the first 300 years of Christianity Christians had no buildings, choirs, etc. They had meetings, prayer, bread, wine, and the Word. As Paul taught, you could hear a pin drop. All gathered in each home where Paul taught hung on his every word.

Since leaving all the hype behind, I've found a depth and peace that surpasses understanding. A reckoning in faith... a knowing by Spirit.

Yes, tongues have their place. Perhaps even dancing has it's place in worship. And yes even tongues have their place (if used in accordance to Scripture). But prompted hype and fast tempo that activates involuntary signals in the brain are not necessary. The vibrado, the false cry... it's all just lost on me today. Give me the Word. Our worship isn't found in a dancing frenzy two to three times a week. Our worship is with our very lives. Driving to work is an act of worship. Adorning ourselves in modesty is an act of worship. Playing with our children is an act of worship. Loving our spouses is an act of worship. Reading our Bible is an act of worship. And in all these things, we keep a heart filled with praise.

I'm just now reading the earlier pages of this thread, some good posts here Pragmatist, Delta, and Aquilla.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

I guess there aren't that many ex-murderers, thieves, liars, proud or immoral people whose lives have been changed by their faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ in Oneness Pentecostal churches any more these days.

I guess I may be the only former really bad sinner in my current church-- no one sees the value in even leaping in praise to God. They must already have an abundance of joy in their hearts.


So if that is you. what would you have to be excited about, right?

You were a good person before you came to Christ-- so it didn't take as much Blood to cover you as it does some of these folks who go through these foolish shenanigans in an attempt to praise and worship our Father, Savior, and Keeper.


Jesus already knew you were a good person before He found you, so He doesn't expect so much from you anyway. Aren't you glad God knows your heart? Now you don't even have to break a sweat in your praise to Him!

He sees your golf claps and is pleased as He sees your heart which was already pretty clean before He got there.

He appreciates your golf claps because He knows He's just the finishing touch on your heart.

Jeremyn, I was exceedingly wicked, and I'm not about to go into here, but the more I contemplate my wickedness, and his holinenes, and how great his grace and mecry was in my life, tears fill my eyes, rather than make me want to get down as if the church was the Club.

I preach in the prisons to the "worst" of sinners by the worlds standards, and those who have come to Christ are overwhelmed by His love and mercy and grace, when nearly everyone else has written them off and judged them Christ reaches for them, and doesn't look at them the same way. I've seen men in such circumstances moved by the gospel presentation, but never seen one of them stand up run around an do cartwheels r roll all over the floor. Of course there is no music when preaching in the jail, so the response is more natural. The music is used as a tool to hype people up.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

Jeremyn, I was exceedingly wicked, and I'm not about to go into here, but the more I contemplate my wickedness, and his holinenes, and how great his grace and mecry was in my life, tears fill my eyes, rather than make me want to get down as if the church was the Club.

I preach in the prisons to the "worst" of sinners by the worlds standards, and those who have come to Christ are overwhelmed by His love and mercy and grace, when nearly everyone else has written them off and judged them Christ reaches for them, and doesn't look at them the same way. I've seen men in such circumstances moved by the gospel presentation, but never seen one of them stand up run around an do cartwheels r roll all over the floor. Of course there is no music when preaching in the jail, so the response is more natural. The music is used as a tool to hype people up.

So everyone has to react and act JUST LIKE YOU?

Hey, if you were there at the gate called Beautiful, without music, you would have saw a man that had just been delivered get up and start leaping! But according to Jason that's not natural. Good grief.

Jason I seen a lot of people come to Christ and weep, then later rejoice with dance or shouting or whatever. Your way is not the only way to react

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

Jeremyn, I was exceedingly wicked, and I'm not about to go into here, but the more I contemplate my wickedness, and his holinenes, and how great his grace and mecry was in my life, tears fill my eyes, rather than make me want to get down as if the church was the Club.

I preach in the prisons to the "worst" of sinners by the worlds standards, and those who have come to Christ are overwhelmed by His love and mercy and grace, when nearly everyone else has written them off and judged them Christ reaches for them, and doesn't look at them the same way. I've seen men in such circumstances moved by the gospel presentation, but never seen one of them stand up run around an do cartwheels r roll all over the floor. Of course there is no music when preaching in the jail, so the response is more natural. The music is used as a tool to hype people up.

And yet scripture tells us to praise God in song and with musical instruments. And yes, some even dance before the Lord. It does not however instruct how fast or slow to do so. And yet in these same churches you are criticizing, I am sure they have people weeping and on their knees before God, humbled by His grace, mercy, and love for them.

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Maybe there are some that God hasn't done so much for them to be so excited about.



Maybe there are some that haven't sinned enough, so the gratitiude expressed to God in leaping, dancing and praising God for His Grace and Mercy is either a foreign concept, or just not necessary.


Maybe there are some for whom God understands that their clothes are expensive, and their ego even more valuable and so they don't ever have to leap in praise to God.


I mean really-- God already knows our hearts, He already knows we appreciate His Kindness-- so where's the value in leaping, raising one's voice, or even losing one's self in praise and worship to God?




Am I closer to understanding the people with a lukewarm response to demonstrative praise and worship now?



Maybe there are some that God hasn't done so much for them to be excited about.

This post is very passive aggressive.

Worship that is about the person, the location, the piano player, the worship leader, how high you jump, how loud you shout, is not worship.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

This post is very passive aggressive.

Worship that is about the person, the location, the piano player, the worship leader, how high you jump, how loud you shout, is not worship.

There's nothing passive about my posts.



Neither have I indicated worship to be about any of the stuff you seem to imply above.

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

There's nothing passive about my posts.



Neither have I indicated worship to be about any of the stuff you seem to imply above.

Every service I've been in (pentecostal and charismatic) that looks like the video you posted is about all of those things.

[houston]

Some of them were in THAT box.

[OneAccord]

I cut my teeth in old fashioned Pentecostal services. Dancing in the Spirit, running the aisles, jumping up and down were normative expressions of worship. They were, in our veiw, Biblical responses to the blessing of God. As the Spirit moved, we moved with Him, as best as we understood. And God moved, blessing, healing, saving, and filling with the Holy Ghost. What some see as "emotionalism' was, to us, worshipping God "in Spirit and in truth". I miss those days. I would trade all the drama teams, the choregraphed dance teams, and the glitzy entertainment found in todays Pentecostal services for one old fashioned, Holy Ghost, Pentecostal rally.

But what can I say? I don't think I was "one born for such a time as this".

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by OneAccord

I cut my teeth in old fashioned Pentecostal services. Dancing in the Spirit, running the aisles, jumping up and down were normative expressions of worship. They were, in our veiw, Biblical responses to the blessing of God. As the Spirit moved, we moved with Him, as best as we understood. And God moved, blessing, healing, saving, and filling with the Holy Ghost. What some see as "emotionalism' was, to us, worshipping God "in Spirit and in truth". I miss those days. I would trade all the drama teams, the choregraphed dance teams, and the glitzy entertainment found in todays Pentecostal services for one old fashioned, Holy Ghost, Pentecostal rally.

But what can I say? I don't think I was "one born for such a time as this".

I think you are.