The dangers of not having a Pastor in your Life...

[edjen01]

i believe there are good pastors....and i believe that having a good one can help you become a better christian, minister, etc.....and that having a bad one can cripple your ministry and pile on a lot of extra baggage.

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by OneAccord

Jer 3:15 And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding.

Give me a pastor like this and I will GLADLY submit to him (or her). They feed, not starve. They lead, not drag. They serve, not lord. The lift up, not tear down. They strengthen, not weaken. They are shepherds, not hirelings. I'll say it again: Give me a pastor like that and I will GLADLY submit to him or her. And I think we've got a few on this forum that fits that description just fine!

Originally Posted by OneAccord

...They gather in, they don't scatter. They visit, they don't shun. They unite, they don't divide. They build up, they don't destroy. They seek God, they don't find fault. The edify the Body, they don't chop it to pieces. They work FOR unity, not against it. They preach the WORD, not their opinion. They preach what GOD said, not what they say.

Wow, feeling kinda "preachy" and I ain't even a preacher!

Actually, YOU ARE a preacher. Mark 16.15 is written to you too!

Originally Posted by OneAccord

Pastors in God's House mend broken hearts, they don't cause them. The lift up the feeble, and don't cripple the spirit. They are peacemakers...not trouble causers. The comfort those who mourn, they don't add to their misery. They lift burdens, they don't pile more on. They preach Christ, not denominations. They are examples of what to be, not of what not to be. They earn respect, but don't demand it. The care of the church is their greatest concern, their own creature comforts is not.


Somebody, stop me!

Originally Posted by OneAccord

And, yes... they reprove, but only with longsuffering and doctrine. They do rebuke, but only with tear filled eyes. They preach Jesus, not just a doctrine ABOUT Jesus. They are watchmen on the wall, but not sowers of discord. They sound the trumpet, but don't toot their own horns.

EXACTLY!!!

The first of many errors comes into play when we divide the church into two classes of people - ministry and laity. This concept is unbiblical and could not be further from what Jesus and the original apostles setup in the first century church.

The second error occurs when we take the "ministry" class and compare it to the Levitical priesthood, and we set them up as kings and princes in our congregations and organizations. The concept of ministry (to minister) is that of service, but the way so many churches are setup these days, it's more like the churches are serving the ministry. And rather than serving the church, they TAKE from the church.

I have a pastor (poimen) in my life, a good man. But he's not infallible and I don't serve him. He truly understands that it is his responsibility to serve the church, to feed us and provide an example for us to imitate (follow). We've put WAY TOO MUCH focus on the "pastor" as the be all, end all of ministry in our congregations, and by doing so we have deprived ourselves the benefits of true apostolic and prophetic ministry. We've allowed pastors to become a "higher class" within the church, and our organizations have become more like country clubs where the good ole boys go to congratulate each other on their accomplishments and conspire ways to create more rules for their subjects to keep them in submission. In the New Testament, the ministry served the churches and were accountable to the churches and elders. We have it completely backward!

Everyone needs a pastor. But it needs to be in the perspective of scripture, with the other offices of ministry represented as well. The conclusion in the opening post of this topic is, indeed, a stretch. But you're right. Everyone should have a pastor.

I'm through. Now, ushers, come and we will recieve the offering.

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by edjen01

i believe there are good pastors....and i believe that having a good one can help you become a better christian, minister, etc.....and that having a bad one can cripple your ministry and pile on a lot of extra baggage.

YEP! I had a REALLY bad one - controlling, rude, cold and downright abusive. So far as ministry goes, I learned more of what not to do from him than anything else.

I have a great one now. But my eyes are not on him, they are on Jesus Christ. "The LORD is my shepherd!"

[crakjak]

Mature spiritual leadership in one's life is a good thing. Since we are all kings and priest unto our God, we can and should be community and mentors in each others life. The Pastor authority as presented in today's culture is not scriptural, servant leadership is certainly scriptural.

BTW I go to church and the church has a pastor, as well as elders and home group leaders. The responsibility is not vested in one man, this protects the body from the weakness and failures that one person has from time to time. Plus this provides for the restoration from those times of weakness, so that mature leadership is not discarded due to momentary failings.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by OneAccord

Jer 3:15 And I will give you pastors according to mine heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding.

Give me a pastor like this and I will GLADLY submit to him (or her). They feed, not starve. They lead, not drag. They serve, not lord. The lift up, not tear down. They strengthen, not weaken. They are shepherds, not hirelings. I'll say it again: Give me a pastor like that and I will GLADLY submit to him or her. And I think we've got a few on this forum that fits that description just fine!

See when presented scripturally, the body readily accepts God's provision. Glory! Just the thought of a leader according to Jer. 3:15 makes me want to shockomoo!!! LOL

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Randy has a death wish starting this thread. The best a pastor is considered here is a necessary evil.

Come on, Bro. Steve, no one on here will reject the Jer. 3:1 type of pastor. If they do they are headed for some purging fire!

I bet you are such a leader, just need to get over some of those extreme standards, then you fit perfectly. j/k, not really.

[Falla39]

Originally Posted by jaamez

YEP! I had a REALLY bad one - controlling, rude, cold and downright abusive. So far as ministry goes, I learned more of what not to do from him than anything else.

I have a great one now. But my eyes are not on him, they are on Jesus Christ. "The LORD is my shepherd!"

Post of the day, week, month, year!!!!!

[Pastor Keith]

Originally Posted by revrandy

2 Chronicles 24....

Amazing Story....

God spared the young man who was protected and seemingly raised by the Priest (Pastor) and his wife...

They build the Temple of God together...

The Priest Passes on...

The Kings ear is turned...

He kills the Priest's Son...

God tries to send Prophets in to replace the Priest...

They are rejected...

and ultimately the King is destroyed for lack of a Pastor...

23And it came to pass at the end of the year, that the host of Syria came up against him: and they came to Judah and Jerusalem, and destroyed all the princes of the people from among the people, and sent all the spoil of them unto the king of Damascus.

24For the army of the Syrians came with a small company of men, and the LORD delivered a very great host into their hand, because they had forsaken the LORD God of their fathers. So they executed judgment against Joash.

25And when they were departed from him, (for they left him in great diseases,) his own servants conspired against him for the blood of the sons of Jehoiada the priest, and slew him on his bed, and he died: and they buried him in the city of David, but they buried him not in the sepulchres of the kings.

26And these are they that conspired against him; Zabad the son of Shimeath an Ammonitess, and Jehozabad the son of Shimrith a Moabitess.

27Now concerning his sons, and the greatness of the burdens laid upon him, and the repairing of the house of God, behold, they are written in the story of the book of the kings. And Amaziah his son reigned in his stead.

I'm am not saying that all Pastor's are perfect examples of what Pastor's Should be...but everybody needs a Pastor in their life.... if you don't have one pray that God will send you One...

A couple of things, first I am a Pastor so I have a bias towards Pastors.

Last night I taught a lesson on God giving you what you need in a package you don't want or like.

Partly in reference to the Election, the scriptures speaks volumes regarding submitting, honoring and obey authority figures, even when their authority manifests itself unjustly. I Peter 2 refers to this.

Now if God calls us to submit, pray, honor worldly human institutions, I think the requirement is more significant in the house of God.

A few things about leadership/elders.

In the NT setting Elders (spiritually mature, seasoned, leader) lead or ruled the local assembly, some of these elders were Pastors, some prophets, some teachers etc.

So in essence we all need elders. In their role as Elder they might fulfill as Pastor's role, Evangelist or Prophet, etc.

Their importance is that when Jesus delegated his authority to his disciples he told them on more than one occasion that if one receives them, then he is being received and if one rejects them then he is being rejected. Of course the authority is derived from speaking words of God.

So as I speak the words of God in my local assembly, I represent Jesus and the authority of God word's to them, if they reject that then according to scripture they reject the authority of Jesus in that assembly.

And accordingly if they receive my words (based on the text, legitimate authority) then they are receiving from Jesus as if he was standing there himself.

The power of binding and loosing is a reference to this as well, of course the key word in that often misused passage is whatever has been loosed in heaven then can be loosed on the earth, Elders if it has not been loosed in heaven, you have no such authority on the earth. This guards against mis-use of authority.

But even illegitimate/false ministers can be the vehicle by which the Lord moves, the passage in Matthew 7 about those that work wonders, miracles, cast out demons, and yet Jesus never knew them is a tremendous warning of being right with God regardless of ministerial results, success or gifting.
Though it is worth pointing out that even with that being said, people did get delivered from Demons, miracles happened and wonders were received by believers. God ultimately judged and held those false workers accountable.

There are many other reasons, but in short we do need Elders, Pastors, leadership, because they do speak in the place of Jesus in a delegated role.

[Steve Epley]

Pastors are a waste of time and money!

[Tyk]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Randy has a death wish starting this thread. The best a pastor is considered here is a necessary evil.

You know better.