The Biblical response to ACTS 2:38

[Aquila]

There's a question I've not heard anyone ask...

What is the purpose of the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

We know that repentance coupled with calling on the name of the Lord in water baptism remits our sins. However, the purpose of the Holy Ghost was explained by Jesus,

(Acts 1:4,5,8 KJV)
(4) And, being assembled together with {them}, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, {saith he}, ye have heard of me. (5) For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. (8) But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

The purpose of the baptism of the Holy Ghost is empowerment.

It's important to understand that the Holy Ghost is active in one's life at the moment of repentance, for how can one repent accept they believe that Jesus is Lord?

1 Corinthians 12:3
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

We know that the Holy Ghost was received and active in the disciples prior to Pentecost...

John 20:22
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

I believe that we often misunderstand the purpose of the Baptism of the Holy Ghost. I believe the purpose is spiritual empowerment to witness, pray, and be led into truth. I see it like this...

Repentance - Justifies one before God.
Water baptism (while calling on the name of the Lord) - Washes away our sins.
Baptism of the Holy Ghost - Empowerment.

Justification, forgiveness, and empowerment. That's the result of Acts 2:38.

I wouldn't go as far as to say that someone who hasn't received the baptism of the Holy Ghost is lost... but I would go as far as to say that they are not walking in the entirety of what Jesus purchased for them at Calvary.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by Aquila

There's a question I've not heard anyone ask...

What is the purpose of the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

We know that repentance coupled with calling on the name of the Lord in water baptism remits our sins. However, the purpose of the Holy Ghost was explained by Jesus,

(Acts 1:4,5,8 KJV)
(4) And, being assembled together with {them}, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, {saith he}, ye have heard of me. (5) For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. (8) But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

The purpose of the baptism of the Holy Ghost is empowerment.

It's important to understand that the Holy Ghost is active in one's life at the moment of repentance, for how can one repent accept they believe that Jesus is Lord?

1 Corinthians 12:3
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

We know that the Holy Ghost was received and active in the disciples prior to Pentecost...

John 20:22
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

I believe that we often misunderstand the purpose of the Baptism of the Holy Ghost. I believe the purpose is spiritual empowerment to witness, pray, and be led into truth. I see it like this...

Repentance - Justifies one before God.
Water baptism (while calling on the name of the Lord) - Washes away our sins.
Baptism of the Holy Ghost - Empowerment.

Justification, forgiveness, and empowerment. That's the result of Acts 2:38.

I wouldn't go as far as to say that someone who hasn't received the baptism of the Holy Ghost is lost... but I would go as far as to say that they are not walking in the entirety of what Jesus purchased for them at Calvary.

Romans 8:9-11; (NIV) Emphasis are mine.

9 You (Spirit filled church in Rome, they had heard and obeyed Acts 2:38), however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God (Holy Ghost) lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ (Holy Ghost), he does not belong to Christ. (Meaning if you do not have the Holy Ghost, you do not belong to Christ.)

10 But if Christ is in you (Holy Ghost), your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness.

11 And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you(God's Spirit, aka, the Holy Ghost), he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you. (In other words, if you have the Holy Ghost, you will have immortal life, aka, go to heaven)

Let me clarify; just because someone has the Holy Ghost doesn't guarantee them entrance to heaven, Paul said we must endure to the end.

[missourimary]

Originally Posted by Justin

Romans 8:9-11; (NIV) Emphasis are mine.

9 You (Spirit filled church in Rome, they had heard and obeyed Acts 2:38), however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God (Holy Ghost) lives in you. What if a person speaks in tongues, but even after years shows themselves controlled by a sinful nature?And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ (Holy Ghost), he does not belong to Christ. (Meaning if you do not have the Holy Ghost, you do not belong to Christ.) This means a lot more than speaking in tongues though.

10 But if Christ is in you (Holy Ghost), your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness.

11 And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you(God's Spirit, aka, the Holy Ghost), he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you. (In other words, if you have the Holy Ghost, you will have immortal life, aka, go to heaven)

Sorry, I appreciate what you are saying, but there was a man in my church who for several years would follow me around talking in tongues while also yelling or muttering that I was backslid, rebellious, unsubmissive, and would go to hell for not marrying him because he told me I had to, and I didn't. He wasn't in any leadership, kind of on the fringes, but then leadership rebuked me for not wanting to call him "brother" and avoiding him. After all, he "had the Holy Ghost"!! Kind of turned me off to the idea that speaking in tongues gave much more than possibly an initial or momentary evidence of anything.

James 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by missourimary

Sorry, I appreciate what you are saying, but there was a man in my church who for several years would follow me around talking in tongues while also yelling or muttering that I was backslid, rebellious, unsubmissive, and would go to hell for not marrying him because he told me I had to, and I didn't. He wasn't in any leadership, kind of on the fringes, but then leadership rebuked me for not wanting to call him "brother" and avoiding him. After all, he "had the Holy Ghost"!! Kind of turned me off to the idea that speaking in tongues gave much more than possibly an initial or momentary evidence of anything.

James 3:11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

I'm sorry for that experience. Let me clarify, and I will edit my first post, just because someone has the Holy Ghost doesn't guarantee them entrance to heaven, Paul said we must endure to the end.

Just because someone has the Holy Ghost doesn't mean they're always right. I'm sure plenty of AoG folks have the Holy Ghost, but still worship a Triune God.

[snicker1986]

Originally Posted by bishoph

Remember that when the report was given to the Jerusalem council concerning Cornelius and his household they identified tongues as the "proof" that the Holy Ghost had fallen on the gentiles the same as it had on the Day of Pentecost. Therefore, it is reasonable to say that every time the writer of the book of Acts says someone received the Holy Ghost they are making that statement based on what they had established as the "initial" sign. If there had been any other "alternative" proof of having received the Holy Ghost it would have been noted.

I appreciate your thoughtful response.

There is no doubt that the report of tongues was used to "prove" to the Jerusalem council that a GENTILE had in fact recieved the Holy Spirit. I beleive that proof was required simply because of the unique nature of this occurance. This was BIG NEWS to the council - Jesus was for everyone, not just Jews (although Jesus himself had said as much).

I am intriguied by the original poster's point, that acts 2:41 says nothing about tongues being spoken or present among the 3000. As I said, God does use tongues in a mighty way, and I beleive that it is the fullness of the promised infilling, but it was ALWAYS instant when it happened and was recorded (and still is today sometimes), never a months or years long process of tarrying at an altar week in and week out. That troubled me when I first came to pentecost, and still does

[snicker1986]

Originally Posted by Aquila

]

We know that the Holy Ghost was received and active in the disciples prior to Pentecost...

John 20:22
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

This is an interesting point that I had never considered. There is no mention in John of them speaking in tongues at that moment. Surely the holy Ghost came right then, and didn't wait until pentecost to arrive. Had they spoken in tongues, surely that would have been noteworthy

[missourimary]

It is my understanding that John 20:22 was more prophetic and symbolic than anything

Symbolism: "He breathed on them" is symbolic of the breath of life of original creation, possibly a symbol of re-creation or rebirth.

And prophecy because there were people in the OT moved on by the Holy Ghost and filled with the Holy Ghost, including Saul, but what would come after Jesus' ascension would be something new and different, thus the mighty rushing wind.

Interestingly, there is a belief that Pentecost was the day the law was given to Moses on Sinai. It was a celebratory and joyful occassion, thus people thinking the disciples were drunk, even in the morning, might not have been a totally unreasonable assumption.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by snicker1986

...
I am intriguied by the original poster's point, that acts 2:41 says nothing about tongues being spoken or present among the 3000. As I said, God does use tongues in a mighty way, and I believe that it is the fullness of the promised infilling, but it was ALWAYS instant when it happened and was recorded (and still is today sometimes), never a months or years long process of tarrying at an altar week in and week out. That troubled me when I first came to pentecost, and still does

OK, stop and think about what happened on the Day of Pentecost as recorded in Acts chapter 2.

There were originally over 500 believers who saw Jesus (1 Corinthians 15:6). 120 of these believers (what's that, about one fourth) were waiting in Jerusalem for an empowering of the Spirit that Jesus referred to as a baptism in the Spirit. As these 120 were gathered together (probably in the Temple) about 9 a.m. the Holy Spirit fell upon them and they began to speak with tongues. This was not their salvation experience. They were already followers of Jesus and had previously ministered in His name/authority. This was an added clothing/enduement of power to do His work.

A crowd gathered and some heard these Spirit filled disciples speaking in tongues and some actually understood what was being said.

Peter stood up and explained that this was a fulfillment of the Old Testament prophecy of Joel that God was now pouring out His Spirit upon all. He continued and preached the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. He concluded with what is recorded in Acts 2:38-40. He told those hearing him:
1. Repent, turn from sin to God, call on Him for mercy, (in other words, get saved)
2. Then follow up that salvation/deliverance experience with baptism/mikveh
3. Then, you also can receive this same enduement or empowering of the Holy Spirit, this promise of the Father, that you have seen demonstrated earlier today.

About 3000 joined themselves to them by believing in Jesus and being baptized.

How many of these 3000 also received the Holy Ghost Baptism? We don't know. It's not recorded. We assume some of them did at that time or later but we don't know that for sure. But, however many of the 3000 who did not receive the Holy Ghost baptism were just as saved as the 380 of the original 500 believers who did not receive the Holy Ghost Baptism.

The agonizing tarrying that we've imposed on people is based on a couple of premises. One is that because 120 people waited/tarried for 10 days to receive the Holy Ghost Baptism that was some kind of a pattern for us today. In the program of God, He had planned to pour out His Spirit universally on Pentecost AD 30. That's when He did it. They could not have received the experience in 3 or 4 or 9 days because God planned it for Pentecost. We've also equated that experience of Pentecost with salvation while it was separate from and subsequent to the salvation of those 120 people. The Holy Ghost wasn't poured out on 120 sinners to save them but was poured out on 120 believers to empower them. After Pentecost if/when people were filled with or baptized in the Spirit, it ordinarily happened by just an outpouring or by hands laid upon them -not after protracted begging, pleading, worshiping, and praising.

[missourimary]

Awesome explaination, Sam!

[*AQuietPlace*]

Great summary, Sam!