Glorying In Sin

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by houston

Last night I puked in the bathroom sink. For some reason I plugged the sink with my shirt while the water was running. Then I passed out against the wall. I was discovered when someone realized there was water leaking from the ceiling of the first floor. I think I should go to A.A., but I'm only an alcoholic when I'm not at work. Maybe I can introduce myself, "My name is ----, and I'm an alcoholic two-sevenths of the time..." Do they still give free coffee and donuts?

What? Are you okay?

[houston]

Originally Posted by Cindy

What? Are you okay?

No. I'm an alcoholic. Did you miss that part? LOL

[AreYouReady?]

Originally Posted by houston

No. I'm an alcoholic. Did you miss that part? LOL

Ok. You admitted your problem. That is half the battle to victory.

[HolyFire]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

It seems that among the AFF crowd here (and those with AFF roots who post primarly on FB) that there is almost a glorying in sin. A glorying in NOT being perfect and being at least a little worldly. These people tend to come across as condenscending towards those who seek to be seperated from the world.

Now listen, I'm not claiming to be perfect, in fact if I say that I have no sin, I make God a liar. I do sin, but I hate it. I don't just say "well nobodies perfect" or "don't judge me just because I sin differently than you", i.e. don't talk about my sin and I won't talk about yours. But my prayer is that God would continue the work of sanctification in my life, to open my eyes to my sin so that I recognize it, repent of it, and discontinue it. I want to live holy. Not just more good than bad, or know enough to be saved and then partake in things that are not beneficial because I am versed in the doctrines of grace. I pray that God will help me to live a life completely (not mostly) pleasing to Him. But I confess to sometimes feeling in the minority, and it can be slightly discouraging at times.

Why don't we care about true holiness anymore? Because many were hoodwinked and abused by authoratarian preachers who overstepped their biblical bounds and used the doctrine of seperation as a rod to beat the sheep? I'm the first to admit that many standards don't have solid (if any) biblical support, especially in the way they are presented (as laws, not principles). I'm the first to admit that most teaching on standards crosses the line and becomes legalism and salvation by works. I believe tha Pauls word in the latter half of Colossians 2 and latter part of 1 Timothy 1 apply to those who confidently assert what they do not know, desiring to be teachers of the law, and in doing so teach things which have the appearence of holiness in man made religion and denying the flesh, but also that the same things are powerless to actually change the heart. HOWEVER..........

The doctrine of seperation from the world is extremely Biblical. In several epistles Paul exhorts the believers to live a life worthy of the Lord. To live a life of defined by godliness. That if anyone desnt teach accordingly he "knows nothing." James says true religion is amongst other things to "keep oneself unspotted from the world" and John reminds us, though well known, it is widey disregarded, "love not the world, neither the things that are in the world" and yet it seems like Christians (especially former apostolics) glory in their freedom to cuss, to entertain themselves with all manner of worldly material, whether movies, music, leisure.

I don't get it. I realize I'm on the opposite track as some of these people, because all their childhood (and even into adulthood) they didn't watch tv, didn't listen to secular music, didn't experience the world, and now that their eyes have been opened to "grace" they "are free to do all these things" (ref. Jeremiah 7). But that's not biblical grace! Biblical grace that bring salvation teaches us to DENY ungodliness and worldy lusts (see Titus 2:11-14), not indulge in these thing, even in "moderation." I wasn't raised in church, my whole life was consumed with worldliness, I lived in most of the sins listed in the NT (Romans 1:28-32, 1 Cor 6:9-10, Col 3 :5-8, 1 John 2:15, etc) and I can not for the life of me understand what any christian would want to do with the world. What does the world offer you? What do you find so attractive? What do you think you will find? I'll tell you, you'l never find it. Those who think they have liberty could find one day their liberty carried them to far. In excercising their "freedom" they end up in bondage. But will most of them hear? No. Instead people who speak up for holiness and separation are met with shouts of "legalist", "weaker brother", etc.

Anyway, I'm done with my rant, just sayin, I don't understand why so many seem so eager to immerse themselves in this godless culture. ~Jason

[Praxeas]

I don't believe anyone will ever answer me

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Yes but the topic is "glorying in sin"

Here is the original assertion

"It seems that among the AFF crowd here (and those with AFF roots who post primarly on FB) that there is almost a glorying in sin. A glorying in NOT being perfect and being at least a little worldly. These people tend to come across as condenscending towards those who seek to be seperated from the world. "

Is it an almost glorying in sin or outright? Please give some examples of this phenomena here on AFF

"Why don't we care about true holiness anymore?"

What is true Holiness. Who is the "we"?

"I realize I'm on the opposite track as some of these people, because all their childhood (and even into adulthood) they didn't watch tv, didn't listen to secular music, didn't experience the world, and now that their eyes have been opened to "grace" they "are free to do all these things" (ref. Jeremiah 7). But that's not biblical grace! Biblical grace that bring salvation teaches us to DENY ungodliness and worldy lusts (see Titus 2:11-14), not indulge in these thing, even in "moderation." I wasn't raised in church, my whole life was consumed with worldliness, I lived in most of the sins listed in the NT (Romans 1:28-32, 1 Cor 6:9-10, Col 3 :5-8, 1 John 2:15, etc) and I can not for the life of me understand what any christian would want to do with the world. "

Isn't "sin" stuff like lying, stealing, fornicating, adultery etc etc, not "TV watching"? Because someone disagrees TV watching is a sin they are classified as disgruntled former Pentecostals gone charismatic and glorying in SIN??? Really?

What is "the world"? Why is TV watching "The world"? Because the world does it? They also do car driving and restaurant going

I could find 1 place where "worldly" is used
Tit 2:12 teaching us that having denied ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live discreetly, righteously and godly, in this present world,

The bible does not define worldly lusts as TV watching or Secular Music listening. Now does that mean you can watch lustful stuff (Like two people having sex)? No that would fall under lusts right?

The problem is "worldly" seems to be rather subjective in definition

Briefly:

Holiness is moral purity, God sets the standard of holiness. We see what true holiness is in the person of Christ. To be Christlike=to be holy. Therefore it should be every Christians desire to be as much like Christ as possible. Of course we all fall short, but our desire should be to continue to become more ad more like Christ.

However for many there desire is salvation not necessarily holiness of life, I do believe there is a distinction. Those who seek salvation don't want to be lost, but once they feel they are saved (and become masters of the doctrines of grace) they desire to be completely like Christ subsides.

As for specifics about glorying in sin, I would say that those who use profanity and excuse it thus feel no need to repent, are glorying in sin. Those who subject themselves to the godless culture and find pleasure in ungodly entertainment and excuse it are gloring in sin. Basically when someone ACCEPTS a sin in their life and believes its nothing to be concerned about and even suggests to other believers that because they don't practice/accept the same in their lives, this is glorying in sin. It is "glorying in sin" because the chrstian essentially says "even though I realize this is wrong, its ok for me to do it because of grace." Its not ok for us to sin, ever. No matter how "big" or "small" the sin is. In the opening post I'm not bewailing the fact that christians sin, but the fact that some don't seem to care.

As fr "worldliness" that's a bit more subjective, but I'd define as the worlds system and values devoid of Christ. If we want to define it let's define it as the secular humanistic and naturaulistic world views so common in our society. Why should a christian take part in such things?

Since you mentioned VV watching let me touch on that. First I wasn't labeling "TV watching" as a sin, in fact I have TV with Dish Network to boot. But as you pointed out above, lying, cheating, fornication, adultery is sin. If I could allow me to add homosexuality, drug use, murder, immodesty, pride, self glorication, drunkeness,profanity are all also sins (I assume we agree). So why do those Christians who ought to be desiring to be Christlike get so much satisfaction out of sitcoms like "Modern Family" featuring a homosexual couple, and movies like "Hunger Games" featuring murder, the come back and say "but there's a good message in it. Hogwash. Sae with secular music, why does a Christian want to listen t the Eagles, to Nirvana, to the Beatles, etc? Isn't this a direct contradiction to Phil 4:8 and Col 3:16? Oh, but it is because "christian music is boring". So we don't mind watching shows and listening to music that God hates, it is literally an abomination to His holiness, BUT it is ok because "were under grace." So we don't strive for holiness (the moral purity and righteousness of God) because we are saved by grace and we have Christs righteousness imputed to us, so when God judges us, He will judge as as righteous as Christ, therefore why make an extra effort to "be holy", so goes the common argument.

To me standards have nothing to do with any of this.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I don't believe anyone will ever answer me

Praxeas, some of us have jobs. In Texas there's still a few left.
Be patient young grass hopper.

[Praxeas]

Please give some real examples of glorying in Sin and slamming Holiness from AFF

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

So why do those Christians who ought to be desiring to be Christlike get so much satisfaction out of sitcoms like "Modern Family" featuring a homosexual couple, and movies like "Hunger Games" featuring murder, the come back and say "but there's a good message in it. Hogwash.

Who? Where?.

Sae with secular music, why does a Christian want to listen t the Eagles, to Nirvana, to the Beatles, etc? Isn't this a direct contradiction to Phil 4:8 and Col 3:16?

Is it because the songs are bad or because they aren't Christian?

So we don't mind watching shows and listening to music that God hates, it is literally an abomination to His holiness, BUT it is ok because "were under grace."

Who? Where? Who said that? "because of Grace"?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I don't believe anyone will ever answer me

Your question has been answered. Apparently you dont get it?