Friend is Unitarian Universalist:

[Aquila]

Here's a Unitarian Universalist's statement regarding what they believe...

I've come to believe that God can be seen in all religions. The same God that was manifest in the man Christ Jesus was present in the man known as Buddah. The same God spoke to the prophets of all faiths. However, this veil of human flesh often interprets the inner promptings of God's Spirit in the cultural lense that it knows and understands. Thus the Hebrew view of God is very Hebraic. The Christian view of God reflects the Grecian influences of early Christianity. The Muslim view of God reflects the cultural norms and values of the Arab tribes. The Hindu view of God reflects the concepts and cultural norms of the Hindi peoples. And given the flavor of Buddhism, even the Buddhist view of the divine reflects Eastern norms and culture. God can even be seen in the rationalist impulses of atheism, though again, interpreted through an atheistic lense.


If we get beyond the veil of flesh in every religion we see one divine light of truth reaching out to man to save mankind from evil, degradation, and abuse. When Jesus said that no man comes to the Father but by Him, the very same divine Spirit of Truth that has spoken in every other faith was speaking. We must not look at the vessel of the man Jesus Christ and think that it personally means that specific human being. It is the Spirit within that was speaking.

Therefore "religion" (meaning all religions) must be taken with a grain of salt. The truths and wisdom that they hold can be shared and honored, but the dogmas are inventions of men.

Thoughts?

[Scott Hutchinson]

If one feels like everyone will eventually be saved,then why would doctrine or Holiness matter ? If your teach everybody will be saved ,then why would you care what anybody believes or what manner of lifestyle a person lives ?

[Scott Hutchinson]

Check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlQYg2ImoRo

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

If one feels like everyone will eventually be saved, then why would doctrine or Holiness matter? If your teach everybody will be saved, then why would you care what anybody believes or what manner of lifestyle a person lives?

Holiness… the “doctrine of holiness”. Well, the way it is typically understood is that the doctrine of holiness is a set list of standards by which one must live in order to be pleasing to God. This include dress codes, standards regarding technology and entertainment, behavioral prohibitions etc. In my opinion, regardless as to what one believes about Hell or Universal Salvation, this is just religion. It’s highly subjective and arbitrary. For example, who’s doctrine of holiness must one obey to be saved? That of the Amish? That of the UPCI? That of their individual church or pastor? A good example is found in that my first pastor taught if one wore wedding bands they were going to Hell and would burn forever. My second pastor didn’t. We see a wide range of “holiness doctrines” that are all dependent upon the opinion of men or a man. It’s highly subjective and arbitrary. Unless God is confused, “holiness doctrine” means nothing…because it could mean anything.

There is another approach that I favor. It’s grounded in the idea of biblical “theosis”…or “becoming God”. This is not in the sense of “becoming an individual god”…but rather allowing God’s own being to permeate and flow through our own person through the presence of the Holy Spirit. In other words… we become Jesus. We put on the mind of Christ. We live with the abiding Christ living in us and through us. We become extensions of God Himself through Christ by virtue of the Spirit indwelling us. We become one spirit with the Lord (I Corinthians 6:17). We become a single organism with Christ, a branch of the true Vine. Incrementally we grow into this new identity of being one with Christ, and thereby one with God. In this we know that Jesus is not only in the Father and that the Father is in Christ… but that this Christ is also… in us. We are quite literally, with regards to the spirit, the “body of Christ”. Therefore, with this in mind, we walk and abide in God’s own holiness…because we and our Heavenly Father (as seen in Christ)… are one.

Now, spirituality is therefore seen as a journey to realize this reality in ourselves, in our very being. Standards become a cheap substitute for this reality. They become empty traditions void of true spiritual life. The result is that we no longer desire religion to live by….we desire to have Jesus Himself… living in us. It is this goal that is encouraged and sought after. Not a list of standards to live by to avoid Hell. Hell is immaterial in this quest. Hell becomes a place wherein wondering souls with no purpose or meaning (the “lost”) find themselves after this life. A place of confinement and confrontation with the reality that they invested in themselves and cultivating self… not Christ… in their own persons. Hell is a nightmare. Make no bones about that. But those who remain there remain there on account of their desire to be individuals, separate and distinct from God. Hell will teach them to surrender. Hell will force them to realize that they will be baptized… either by the Holy Ghost… or with fire. In the end… every soul will surrender and bow their knees and confess with their mouths that Jesus is indeed Lord. It is at this point that they begin their journey to realize Christ.

Christ is the sole goal for our spiritual development. This is where “living right” (living the Christ life) comes in with those who believe in Universalism. Hell doesn’t impress anyone. The vast majority of people who have rejected the church have done so on account of the doctrine of Hell. How can finite sins incur eternal torments? It’s unbalanced…unjust. How can God burn a person forever for stealing bubble gum? The punishment must fit the crime. Universalism brings this framework home to a realized theology.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

If one feels like everyone will eventually be saved,then why would doctrine or Holiness matter ? If your teach everybody will be saved ,then why would you care what anybody believes or what manner of lifestyle a person lives ?

The best argument I've heard for this, Scott, is, "If everyone eventually grows up to become an adult, what is the point of an education? Don't know how apt it might be...

And Aquila, although I haven't pursued this, I have heard that all the great "religious" works started out...agreeing with Scripture? Not sure if I'm putting that right. Have to think of where I even read the thing, now--meant to follow up on it, as it was fairly compelling, had ref's, etc. I remember particularly the "breakdown" of Indian religion being discussed, how they (Indians) used to all recognize only one God (Who is still back there, somewhere), temples only to Him (Krishna? I forget), with only a nod to other "gods;" who all now have crowded out "God," for most Indians, I guess.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Holiness… the “doctrine of holiness”. Well, the way it is typically understood is that the doctrine of holiness is a set list of standards by which one must live in order to be pleasing to God. This include dress codes, standards regarding technology and entertainment, behavioral prohibitions etc. In my opinion, regardless as to what one believes about Hell or Universal Salvation, this is just religion. It’s highly subjective and arbitrary. For example, who’s doctrine of holiness must one obey to be saved? That of the Amish? That of the UPCI? That of their individual church or pastor? A good example is found in that my first pastor taught if one wore wedding bands they were going to Hell and would burn forever. My second pastor didn’t. We see a wide range of “holiness doctrines” that are all dependent upon the opinion of men or a man. It’s highly subjective and arbitrary. Unless God is confused, “holiness doctrine” means nothing…because it could mean anything.

There is another approach that I favor. It’s grounded in the idea of biblical “theosis”…or “becoming God”. This is not in the sense of “becoming an individual god”…but rather allowing God’s own being to permeate and flow through our own person through the presence of the Holy Spirit. In other words… we become Jesus. We put on the mind of Christ. We live with the abiding Christ living in us and through us. We become extensions of God Himself through Christ by virtue of the Spirit indwelling us. We become one spirit with the Lord (I Corinthians 6:17). We become a single organism with Christ, a branch of the true Vine. Incrementally we grow into this new identity of being one with Christ, and thereby one with God. In this we know that Jesus is not only in the Father and that the Father is in Christ… but that this Christ is also… in us. We are quite literally, with regards to the spirit, the “body of Christ”. Therefore, with this in mind, we walk and abide in God’s own holiness…because we and our Heavenly Father (as seen in Christ)… are one.

Now, spirituality is therefore seen as a journey to realize this reality in ourselves, in our very being. Standards become a cheap substitute for this reality. They become empty traditions void of true spiritual life. The result is that we no longer desire religion to live by….we desire to have Jesus Himself… living in us. It is this goal that is encouraged and sought after. Not a list of standards to live by to avoid Hell. Hell is immaterial in this quest. Hell becomes a place wherein wondering souls with no purpose or meaning (the “lost”) find themselves after this life. A place of confinement and confrontation with the reality that they invested in themselves and cultivating self… not Christ… in their own persons. Hell is a nightmare. Make no bones about that. But those who remain there remain there on account of their desire to be individuals, separate and distinct from God. Hell will teach them to surrender. Hell will force them to realize that they will be baptized… either by the Holy Ghost… or with fire. In the end… every soul will surrender and bow their knees and confess with their mouths that Jesus is indeed Lord. It is at this point that they begin their journey to realize Christ.

Christ is the sole goal for our spiritual development. This is where “living right” (living the Christ life) comes in with those who believe in Universalism. Hell doesn’t impress anyone. The vast majority of people who have rejected the church have done so on account of the doctrine of Hell. How can finite sins incur eternal torments? It’s unbalanced…unjust. How can God burn a person forever for stealing bubble gum? The punishment must fit the crime. Universalism brings this framework home to a realized theology.

Universalism is the ultimate rejection of the authority of God. It is so disgusting imo that the term "holiness" always has to be apologized for. To anyone who has come to a true relationship with God it should be a given that holy living is being joined to Christ.

And there is nothing wrong with teaching HOLINESS is a life separated to and obedient to the teachings of Yeshua.

To be obedient to Yeshua IS equated with holiness in the Bible.

13Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober , and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;14As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:15But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;16 Because it is written , Be ye holy; for I am holy. 1 Peter 1:13-16

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

The time is coming when they will. Every living creature will be worshipping Yeshua. However most that ever lived will not be living then. They will have died the 2nd death.

All death is defeated by the work of righteous of Christ, first, second, and if there be any other. The last enemy of God.

Verse 13, is very inclusive, "...every creature in heaven, on earth, in the world below, and in the sea—all living beings in the universe..." death cannot hold God's creation.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Which was what? what was the conflict?

His view of the few, being the limits on those finally saved vs the masses of Revelation 5, that are saved. That is the conflict for the literalists and the legalists.

[Dedicated Mind]

Originally Posted by crakjak

His view of the few, being the limits on those finally saved vs the masses of Revelation 5, that are saved. That is the conflict for the literalists and the legalists.

how do you interpret "narrow is the way and few there be that find it"?

[houston]

Well then most of my family are Catholic U.U.