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10-06-2012, 07:05 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by LooneyLucy
Well? I never see where God changed his opinion of David.
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David was a King. We aren't talking about a king. We are talking about Pastors
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-06-2012, 07:06 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by LooneyLucy
Well? I never see where God changed his opinion of David.
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BTW you did not answer the question. The qualifications we are reviewing are not those of a King..so does a man who cheated on his wife for 4 years have a good reputation?
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-06-2012, 07:47 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 110
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
BTW you did not answer the question. The qualifications we are reviewing are not those of a King..so does a man who cheated on his wife for 4 years have a good reputation?
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Pro 24:16 For a just 6662 [man] falleth 5307 seven times 7651, and riseth up again 6965 : but the wicked 7563 shall fall 3782 into mischief 7451.
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10-06-2012, 05:33 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,600
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Four years is a long time. It is not merely an indiscretion, but a prolonged act that both involved knew exactly what they were doing. Since he resigned when people found out, it kind of makes me wonder if he is sorry that he committed the 4-year act, or if he is sorry that he was found out? And what about her? Why is everybody so focused on the pastor when she shares equal shame? It's not about him supposedly 'knowing better', since in the eyes of God he really is no better than 'her'.
But this man's motive or what he did is neither here nor there in my questioning how the church system treats its fallen.
What I want to know is why can't a man, who has committed adultery be restored into some sort of ministry if he truly is repentant and forgiven by God?
Geesh....I knew a minister who was in prison and admitted from the pulpit raping, robbing and killing other prisoners before he repented and obtained forgiveness from God. This man was given a UPC license.
I understand what Ms B is trying to say about trust. I mean, even if the congregation forgave and retained the minister to be pastor, his indiscretion would never be forgotten. The first time he tries to administer council that somebody else does not agree with, his indiscretion will be thrown into his face for sure. In this case, he would have to leave the area.
I also agree that forgiveness, restoration to God and position are different things.
Which leads me to believe that positions in the church system should be eliminated and that all men who are seriously studious of the Word and have the indwelling Holy Spirit should minister to the people, freely, without payment. The people can still vote righteous men to handle building finances and use the rest for benevolent funds to feed and clothe people in the name of Jesus.
jmho, which usually doesn't mean anything to anybody else.
__________________
It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man. (Psalms 118:8)
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10-06-2012, 08:04 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 110
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Yes, I believe he does have a GREAT reputation. A weakness, no matter how long that weakness lasts, does not make a person a BAD person. As another pastor said on here...pastors are under a tremendous stress load. Some crack under that weight.
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10-06-2012, 08:13 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,888
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by LooneyLucy
Yes, I believe he does have a GREAT reputation. A weakness, no matter how long that weakness lasts, does not make a person a BAD person. As another pastor said on here...pastors are under a tremendous stress load. Some crack under that weight.
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A person who commits adultery for years has a good reputatio? Well, that's just looney.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
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10-06-2012, 08:21 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 110
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthseeker
A person who commits adultery for years has a good reputatio? Well, that's just looney.
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Do you drink? As in liquor????
I don't because "don't let your good be evil spoken of".
We all have different definitions don't we.
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10-06-2012, 08:27 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by LooneyLucy
Yes, I believe he does have a GREAT reputation. A weakness, no matter how long that weakness lasts, does not make a person a BAD person. As another pastor said on here...pastors are under a tremendous stress load. Some crack under that weight.
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Wow..a man that was secretly carrying on a sexual relationship with someone other than his wife for 4 years has a great reputation....
and you called us liberal?
BTW we aren't talking about whether someone is a good person or bad person.
We are discussing what the bible says about qualifications for pastoring
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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10-06-2012, 08:35 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 110
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
Wow..a man that was secretly carrying on a sexual relationship with someone other than his wife for 4 years has a great reputation....
and you called us liberal?
BTW we aren't talking about whether someone is a good person or bad person.
We are discussing what the bible says about qualifications for pastoring
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Hmmm and I thot you were talking about reputation. I agree he had to step down, just don't agree with your "shunning" attitude.
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10-06-2012, 08:41 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Re: Restoration after a moral failure
Quote:
Originally Posted by LooneyLucy
Hmmm and I thot you were talking about reputation. I agree he had to step down, just don't agree with your "shunning" attitude.
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We ARE talking about reputation.
I challenge you to quote me once saying someone should be shunned. That is a lie.
You've done that several times to me and others. After a while it became a regular pattern for you.
We were NEVER discussing shunning. We were discussing qualifications of a Pastor and you knew that.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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