Well you guys wanna pick bones, knock yerself out. Someone in the UPC hurt your feelings and you want to pitch a tent and camp there? be my guest.
I am sorta like the drill sergeant therapist in the new geico commercial..
If I had a quarter for every time in Navy boot camp Petty officer Marler or Chief Savaiinaia offended my sensibilities I'd be a millionaire.
I am really sorry, my tolerance for crybabies is 0. Cowboy up and live for God and stop whining.
I was a submariner and military before all the touchy-feely nonsense.
soooo....
Grow up and get over it.
I served 6 years in the Marines and tried to bring this Military analogy into my ministry. I've pastored for 14 years and have tried different things to help people understand God and His Will. In fact, so did my first Pastor who tried Military tactics in a spiritually based environment, and it destroyed him, while the entire Church fell apart.
He was a strict and squared away Marine. He made Staff Sergeant (E-5) in 6 years, and his military example was stellar. But, this didn't work with the Church and people who don't understand the Military way of life.
Less than 2 percent of Americans serve in the Military, and some statistics say less than 1 percent. Your ranting about calling God's People to attention, or wanting them to just "Fall In", won't work and is not God's plan according to His Word.
Your "grow up and get over it" mentality is not only immature, but leans on making anyone who doesn't agree with you as weak, or not willing to join your "Army".
I've come to understand one thing about Church; It is FULL of people who would never survive Marine Corps boot camp.
Like JA I love the UPC. The Universal Pricing Code has made life so much easier. The speed with which people either check us out or we check ourselves out at a store is amazing compared to the days when I worked at a grocer store with a "pricing gun" attaching little price labels to every single product. Naturally many came of or were unreadable so checkers were constantly having to do "price checks". People under the age of 50 or so just have no idea what it was like before the UPC!
__________________ "I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
I can't say, "I love the UPCI" because to me the UPCI is a political/religious/business organization but I can say I love the people in the UPCI.
I can say I was baptized in Jesus' name in a UPC church
Elim Tabernacle in Milwaukee, WI on October 27, 1955
I can say I was baptized in the Holy Spirit in a UPC church
Bethel Tabernacle in Racine, WI on May 20, 1956 (Pentecost Sunday)
I am not now, nor have I ever been, licensed or ordained as a minister in the UPC and doubt if I will be at any time in the near future.
I did not get saved in the UPC. I was saved before I started going to a UPC church.
I did not get married in the UPC. I was married in the living room of my wife's grandparents house. Her grandfather performed the ceremony and he belonged to The Church of Jesus Christ.
Ah well, what was was telling you people to grow up and get over was your hatred of the UPC, bad on me. CH Tatum is right. I helped Jim Yohe set up FCF, during a phase when NFCF was shut down for awhile I set up a forum for free for all the members to hang out at, called "the island".
I setup AFF for the owners therof and have worked to keep the backend going, fixed it when it was broke etc etc.
The true colors of this place now shine through. I express my love for an org I am not a part of (BTW, I love the ALJC too, not a member there either) and state they do a lot more good than bad, and I get jumped on by a pack of wolves.
So... ya'll have at it. I wash my hands of this place and will have nothing further to do with it.
This isn't an immature hissey fit, lets just say the straws have been piling on for quite some time. Everytime I read a post or a thread badmouthing some preacher or org another straw gets added. This thread was simply the final one.
The silent benefactor of 7 years has left the building...ciao people.
__________________
Last edited by John Atkinson; 08-17-2010 at 05:58 AM.
The true colors of this place now shine through. I express my love for an org I am not a part of (BTW, I love the ALJC too, not a member there either) and state they do a lot more good than bad, and I get jumped on by a pack of wolves.
So... ya'll have at it. I wash my hands of this place and will have nothing further to do with it.
This isn't an immature hissey fit, lets just say the straws have been piling on for quite some time. Everytime I read a post or a thread badmouthing some preacher or org another straw gets added. This thread was simply the final one.
The silent benefactor of 7 years has left the building...ciao people.
It's not the love you express that is the problem. It is the backhanding of those you differ with while saying you're not backhanding them that is the problem. That's great you've been a silent benefactor and all, but it doesn't make me change my views.
__________________
Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the people doing it. ~Chinese Proverb
When I was young and clever, I wanted to change the world. Now that I am older and wiser, I strive to change myself. ~
It's not the love you express that is the problem. It is the backhanding of those you differ with while saying you're not backhanding them that is the problem. That's great you've been a silent benefactor and all, but it doesn't make me change my views.
Exactly correct! John HIMSELF took a shot at the UPC in his opening diatribe. But somehow none of us can. That's very inconsistent and completely unfair.
I recently sat with a young man who poured his heart out about the things that he's experienced through his lifetime within the circles of the UPC, and it's the stuff that happens, not just in isolated places, but things that only take place in hard-line pentecostal churches. My goodness, the damage that's been done to him is unthinkable, and it was from THE SYSTEM, not some out-of-control preacher. We're talking District Boards, here.
So maybe you'd prefer we all be silent about the heartache and abuse that happens because of THE SYSTEM, but somebody needs to say something!!!
But somehow it's ok if you (John) throw in your dig about not agreeing with the doctrine, but then WE'RE the ones that are wrong. The game you're playing isn't fair.
All that being said, thank you for the times you've worked tirelessly to restore the forum when it's been broken. You have my applause for that.
Exactly correct! John HIMSELF took a shot at the UPC in his opening diatribe. But somehow none of us can. That's very inconsistent and completely unfair.
I recently sat with a young man who poured his heart out about the things that he's experienced through his lifetime within the circles of the UPC, and it's the stuff that happens, not just in isolated places, but things that only take place in hard-line pentecostal churches. My goodness, the damage that's been done to him is unthinkable, and it was from THE SYSTEM, not some out-of-control preacher. We're talking District Boards, here.
So maybe you'd prefer we all be silent about the heartache and abuse that happens because of THE SYSTEM, but somebody needs to say something!!!
But somehow it's ok if you (John) throw in your dig about not agreeing with the doctrine, but then WE'RE the ones that are wrong. The game you're playing isn't fair.
All that being said, thank you for the times you've worked tirelessly to restore the forum when it's been broken. You have my applause for that.
John didn't take a shot. He merely pointed out the UPC would not take him nor would he want to. That's probably due to doctrinal differences.
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
John didn't take a shot. He merely pointed out the UPC would not take him nor would he want to. That's probably due to doctrinal differences.
Yes he did. It's fairly subversive, fairly subtle, but he did. He is refusing to take part with the UPC while proclaiming his glowing adoration of it. You can't have it both ways. Jesus said it's either one way or the other, right? "For me or against me."
I happen to be comfortable enough in my own skin to openly admit, I'm against it. John wants to sugarcoat it. "I love you but I want nothing to do with you." Nuh uh.
Ah well, what was was telling you people to grow up and get over was your hatred of the UPC, bad on me. CH Tatum is right. I helped Jim Yohe set up FCF, during a phase when NFCF was shut down for awhile I set up a forum for free for all the members to hang out at, called "the island".
I setup AFF for the owners therof and have worked to keep the backend going, fixed it when it was broke etc etc.
The true colors of this place now shine through. I express my love for an org I am not a part of (BTW, I love the ALJC too, not a member there either) and state they do a lot more good than bad, and I get jumped on by a pack of wolves.
So... ya'll have at it. I wash my hands of this place and will have nothing further to do with it.
This isn't an immature hissey fit, lets just say the straws have been piling on for quite some time. Everytime I read a post or a thread badmouthing some preacher or org another straw gets added. This thread was simply the final one.
The silent benefactor of 7 years has left the building...ciao people.
I understand this view completely....it is this attitude and constant sniping at not only the UPC but any person or group perceived as holding traditional views...that has driven so many great members off of this forum.
After a while they just got sick of this garbage.
I very seldom post and when I do i get dogpiled on...called names and ridiculed....
Of course I give it back...and hand out some of my own so I really dont have any place to complain....
However the extreme bias that is so prevalent on here does get tiresome.
I understand this view completely....it is this attitude and constant sniping at not only the UPC but any person or group perceived as holding traditional views...that has driven so many great members off of this forum.
After a while they just got sick of this garbage.
I very seldom post and when I do i get dogpiled on...called names and ridiculed....
Of course I give it back...and hand out some of my own so I really dont have any place to complain....
However the extreme bias that is so prevalent on here does get tiresome.
BTW, I am not advocating name calling and ridiculing. But I don't like it from either end.
There is a bias here on AFF towards venting about the UPC, I think. But, in your circles there is a bias against those who are not UPC, so, it works both directions.
I just think it is ridiculous to silently seethe and then come out blasting about how "wrong" it is to have different opinions than traditional UPC ones. People have been hurt and need a place to vent. It makes me think of the scripture "You who are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness, considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted". If you consider yourself to be spiritual, your obligation is to restore in meekness, not in name calling and ridicule. And yes, that works both ways too.
__________________
Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the people doing it. ~Chinese Proverb
When I was young and clever, I wanted to change the world. Now that I am older and wiser, I strive to change myself. ~
Hybrid Mode
