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07-03-2007, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rico
How can a single man be the husband of any wife? That hasn't stopped single men from going into the ministry.
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If by "the ministry" you mean "pastor" then I'm not sure there's a biblical basis for single men to serve in that position.
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07-03-2007, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson
Can a woman be a Pastor of a local assembly ?
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No.
Quote:
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It this scriptural or agains't scripture?
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Against scripture. Among the requirements for a pastor (bishop/overseeing elder) is that he be the husband of one wife and that he rule his household well. Also, Paul specifically stated that he did not allow women to teach (impart doctrine, which is a significant part of what the pastor does).
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Does the Bible permit or forbid a woman to oversee a local church ?
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No. Note 1 Timothy 2:12-14 (underlining is mine)...
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor."
NONE OF THIS, HOWEVER, PRECLUDES WOMEN FROM SERVING GOD IN OTHER WAYS, SUCH AS OBEYING THE GREAT COMMISSION AND EXERCISING SPIRITUAL GIFTS.
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07-03-2007, 11:58 AM
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Strange in a Strange Land...
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Island
Posts: 5,512
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[QUOTE=Chan;174744]No.
Against scripture. Among the requirements for a pastor (bishop/overseeing elder) is that he be the husband of one wife and that he rule his household well. Also, Paul specifically stated that he did not allow women to teach (impart doctrine, which is a significant part of what the pastor does).No. Note 1 Timothy 2:12-14 (underlining is mine)...
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor."QUOTE]
Paul may not have allowed it because Adam was made first before Eve. But that doen't mean God does not allow it. There are men in the oneness movement that will only wear and teach that people should only wear long sleeves. That does not mean God disallows the wearing of short sleeves. The man is to be the head of the house but the women can be a Pastor. But maybe more in a Co-Pastor role.
Look at Joyce Meyer. She is the preacher and pastor of sorts. But she will straight up tell you that Dave, her husband, is the spiritual leader and what he says goes. But she has the public ministry. He takes care of the behind the scenes things much like is common practice among pastors wives or lay ministers.
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07-03-2007, 12:02 PM
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GET IT RIGHT!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: WI
Posts: 1,542
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan
NONE OF THIS, HOWEVER, PRECLUDES WOMEN FROM SERVING GOD IN OTHER WAYS, SUCH AS OBEYING THE GREAT COMMISSION AND EXERCISING SPIRITUAL GIFTS.
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Both of which includes "IMPARTING DOCTRINE"! Or at least, you better hope thats what happens instead of simply imparting one's own thoughts and opinions!
Women have, can and do pastor. GOD's word does not forbid it but rather plainly makes provision for it.
Men that think otherwise are about as strange as that dog mentioned previously, walking on its hind legs.
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07-03-2007, 12:03 PM
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[quote=JTULLOCK;174750]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chan
No.
Against scripture. Among the requirements for a pastor (bishop/overseeing elder) is that he be the husband of one wife and that he rule his household well. Also, Paul specifically stated that he did not allow women to teach (impart doctrine, which is a significant part of what the pastor does).No. Note 1 Timothy 2:12-14 (underlining is mine)...
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor."QUOTE]
Paul may not have allowed it because Adam was made first before Eve. But that doen't mean God does not allow it. There are men in the oneness movement that will only wear and teach that people should only wear long sleeves. That does not mean God disallows the wearing of short sleeves. The man is to be the head of the house but the women can be a Pastor. But maybe more in a Co-Pastor role.
Look at Joyce Meyer. She is the preacher and pastor of sorts. But she will straight up tell you that Dave, her husband, is the spiritual leader and what he says goes. But she has the public ministry. He takes care of the behind the scenes things much like is common practice among pastors wives or lay ministers.
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Since Paul wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Ghost, we must take his prohibition to be God's prohibition.
Just because people do things in the Church today doesn't make it right.
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07-03-2007, 12:05 PM
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Sister Alvear
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Brazil, SA
Posts: 27,042
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Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
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07-03-2007, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyRev
Both of which includes "IMPARTING DOCTRINE"! Or at least, you better hope thats what happens instead of simply imparting one's own thoughts and opinions!
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Neither of those involve imparting doctrine. In the former, one is merely communicating the message of salvation. In the second, there is a variety of gifts and not all of them involve speaking. As for the speaking gifts, tongues and interpretation is nothing more than the person being used as a vessel through which the Holy Ghost speaks and, thus, it is not the person who is imparting anything but, instead, the Holy Ghost. The utterance of prophecy does not always include doctrine but there too it isn't the person who is speaking but, instead, God speaking through that person.
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Women have, can and do pastor. GOD's word does not forbid it but rather plainly makes provision for it.
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Show me even one New Testament passage that shows a woman as the pastor of a church. Show me even one New Testament passage that lists the qualifications for pastor (bishop/overseer) where a woman would be able to fill all of those qualifications.
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07-03-2007, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sister Alvear
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
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Yes, humans are born having Adam's sin (not Eve's) imputed to them and, therefore, bear the consequences of that sin. However, Jesus is the second Adam and we as Christians have His righteousness imputed to us.
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07-03-2007, 12:18 PM
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Sister Alvear
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Brazil, SA
Posts: 27,042
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God told Adam not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. “But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die ( Genesis 2:17).” Satan deceived Eve. “And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression ( 1 Timothy 2:14 ).” “And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat ( Genesis 3:6).” Adam ate of the tree, knowing God said not to, and the curse of death entered into the world. “And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return ( Genesis 3:17–19).” Because of Adam’s sin, we become sinners by birth. And when we get old enough to know right and wrong, we become sinners by choice. “As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one ( Romans 3:10 )...” “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God ( Romans 3:23) ...” The consequence of sin is death. “For the wages of sin is death ( Romans 6:23) ...”
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07-03-2007, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sister Alvear
God told Adam not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. “But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die ( Genesis 2:17).” Satan deceived Eve. “And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression ( 1 Timothy 2:14 ).” “And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat ( Genesis 3:6).” Adam ate of the tree, knowing God said not to, and the curse of death entered into the world. “And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return ( Genesis 3:17–19).” Because of Adam’s sin, we become sinners by birth. And when we get old enough to know right and wrong, we become sinners by choice. “As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one ( Romans 3:10 )...” “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God ( Romans 3:23) ...” The consequence of sin is death. “For the wages of sin is death ( Romans 6:23) ...”
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Yes, Adam was without excuse.
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