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  #61  
Old 06-15-2008, 06:16 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea View Post
Is doubt a sin too?

I believe UNBELIEF is ...

Doubt is not necessarily unbelief
Sure it is!
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  #62  
Old 06-15-2008, 06:32 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by MissBrattified View Post
I have a hard time believing that any involuntary feeling or emotion could be called "sin."



I think the Bible encourages us to trust in God, but I don't believe worry is a sin. It could be a symptom of not relying on God enough, and points to a hole in the Relationship that needs to be worked on.
Would be great if my feelings and emotions were not voluntary.... I know I am allowing my feelings and emotions.
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  #63  
Old 06-15-2008, 07:27 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

Was this sin?

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  #64  
Old 06-15-2008, 09:34 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea View Post
Was this sin?

Dan, by faith Jesus got over the anxiety He had exhibited in prayer in the garden. He didn't let the anxiety cripple His faith and cause Him to disobey the will of His Father through unbelief. He had the sentence of death in Himself and was resurrected just as He knew the OT scriptures said He would be.
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  #65  
Old 06-15-2008, 09:36 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
Dan, by faith Jesus got over the anxiety He had exhibited in prayer in the garden. He didn't let the anxiety cripple His faith and cause Him to disobey the will of His Father through unbelief. He had the sentence of death in Himself and was resurrected just as the OT scriptures said He would be.
Agreed ... but some have said, even in this thread, that it is a sin... not just that it can be ...

If it is a sin then Jesus sinned.
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  #66  
Old 06-15-2008, 10:06 PM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea View Post
Was this sin?

How could it be sin, if the Scripture says He knew no sin? IICor 5:21

Could it be that baseless fear or fear of the wrong thing is sin? Not all fear is evil nor is all faith righteous.
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  #67  
Old 06-16-2008, 12:05 AM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
OK define anxiety?
Definition:

1. feeling of worry: nervousness or agitation, often about something that is going to happen

2. something that worries somebody: a subject or concern that causes worry

3. strong wish to do something: the strong wish to do something, especially if the wish is unnecessarily or unhealthily strong
his anxiety to please

4. psychiatry extreme apprehension: a medical condition marked by intense apprehension or fear of real or imagined danger

----------------

And I will tell you this.... it is not necessarily a mental thing. I can completely rationalize something in the mind, and KNOW that there is nothing to worry about, yet still have feelings and symptoms of anxiety. I think unbelief is more of a conscious mental decision than an emotional response.
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  #68  
Old 06-16-2008, 07:23 AM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MissBrattified View Post
I have a hard time believing that any involuntary feeling or emotion could be called "sin."



I think the Bible encourages us to trust in God, but I don't believe worry is a sin. It could be a symptom of not relying on God enough, and points to a hole in the Relationship that needs to be worked on.
Isn't worry a form of unbelief?
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  #69  
Old 06-16-2008, 09:42 AM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esther View Post
Sure it is!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esther View Post
Hummm

Doubt is a sin, isn't it?

He could be right.

Are you anixous about this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea View Post
Is doubt a sin too?

I believe UNBELIEF is ...

Doubt is not necessarily unbelief
Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew View Post
Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because [he eateth] not of faith: for whatsoever [is] not of faith is sin.
-----------------------------
From discussions at Synadelfos:
----------------------------

I submit that doubt is not the absence of hope - unbelief is. Hope leads us to the bridge to a place called faith.

Doubt .... means we're still open to the possibility of a miracle ... unbelief means we've closed up shop.

Let me explain.

You've been feeling really sick ... and You're sitting in the doctor's office and he's told you he has the results of your blood tests.

Which would you rather hear ....???

-------------------------------------------

Option A - Total Unbelief


Sir, or m'am ... we've looked at all the medical exams and you are going to die within 6 weeks. There is no hope.

or

Option B - Doubt .. Perhaps yes ... perhaps no


Sir ... we've looked at all the medical exams and it doesn't look good ... but there is a slight chance you can survive this ...

I'll take option B ... doubt ... it means there's still hope ...

Doubt is not the absence of faith ... it is a crossroads ... a choice to be made between unbelief or deeper faith.

The key is bringing our doubt to Jesus, our Hope. Bringing doubt and laying it down at the feet of the magnitude of our situation and allowing it to kill our hope will result in UNBELIEF.

Doubt is simply asking "What if".

Jesus can work w/ and around our doubt ... it's our unbelief that will condemn us.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Some Examples:

1. Jesus himself is our example of doubt. He struggled in the Garden of Gethsemane and on the cross he cried out, “My God, my God why have you forsaken me?”

He knew his mission was to die ... yet he asks if this cup could be passed ... is this not doubt?

Let's be continue to be honest about our doubts and to express them in the context of Christian community. Let's not be ashamed of our. Let's have the courage to share them with your sisters and brothers in the faith.

That's why the faith-based discussions we have on these forums are so vital. We have the chance to feed faith through the Word of God and our fellowship to one another. Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.

Many of us come from a culture where doubting is frowned upon ... asking faith based questions are stifled ... not being lock-step in what we believe is chastised.

Guess what?

--------------------------------------------------------------------

2. I've got doubts ... But like the man , in the book of Mark, who told Jesus just on the verge of a miraculous breakthrough .....

"I do believe; help me overcome my unbelief!"

Did Jesus stop in his tracks and say ... well if there's some doubt ... I can't give you what you want ... the deliverance of your demon-possessed son.

No ... he rewarded the measure of faith he did have.

Presbyterian minister, Frederick Buechner has a great definition of doubt: “Whether your faith is that there is a God or that there is not a God, if you don’t have any doubts, you are either kidding yourself, or asleep. Doubts are the ants in the pants of faith. They keep it awake and moving.

How many of us have doubted,at times that God will forgive us for the last thing we got mixed up in ... yet still ask for forgiveness. And yet he does ... despite our tinge of doubt.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

3. John the Baptist it seems doubted even for a brief moment that Jesus was the Christ, the Anointed One that was to come. John asked through his disciples "are you the One to come or should we expect someone else (Matthew 11:2)? Earlier he had emphatically declared that Christ was the One to come since he had seen the Spirit as a dove descend upon the Lord (John 1:33-34). There seems to be doubt in John's prison experience although he had declared "BEHOLD THE LAMB OF GOD ... WHO TAKES AWAY THE SINS ON MEN.

a) John knew Christ experientially. He lept in the womb. He saw the dove and heard the voice at the baptism. He publicly acknowledged his need of Christ.
b) However, in the lowest season of his life when he, a prophet of God, was falsely accused and imprisoned on the vengeful whim of an evil woman, he was filled with doubt. What had happened to the promise? Was he really the Christ or not?
c) The beauty of this passage is the response that Jesus had to John's doubt. He did not chastise him, rather he set the facts before him...again, without accusation. He also proceeded to publicly honor him and reinforce the reason for his calling.

Doubt does not set God against man, but rather "he was touched with the feelings of our infirmities, but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin..." Hebrews 4:15-16 Doubt sets us up to find answers, to find help in time of trouble, to find grace in time of need.

4. Consider the Old Testament. Judges 6:11-7:22

Remember the story of Gideon? How did the Lord respond to Gideon's doubt? He responded by providing for his need and his questions. God literally gave him the signs he requested: the supernaturally burnt offering, the angel face to face, the fleece (twice). The Lord also graciously allowed Gideon to fear and doubt when he was commanded to act: he allowed the surreptitious nighttime removal of the altar to Baal; he told Gideon to take his servant with him into the enemy camp (in case he was afraid and he was); he allowed him to overhear the dream which foretold his (Gideon's) victory.

Both of these recorded instances of man's doubt in the face of God's graciousness gives me hope the God will deal with me in the same manner. In my moments and seasons of doubt, he will and he has led me to find answers without condemnation. "For there is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus..." Romans 8:1 Questions bring answers. "Seek and you shall find..."

Doubt is not a sin. It is a symptom in search of a diagnosis. Then the master surgeon can do his work in our lives.

--------------------------------------------------------------

5. And it appears in context that some of the 11 disciples doubted His resurrection ... even when face to face w/ the Risen Lord and having worshipped Him.

Matthew 28 16-20


16 But the eleven disciples proceeded (P)to Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had designated.

17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some were doubtful.

18 And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

19" Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,

20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

Seems they doubted the Work of the Lamb in His Resurrection ... yet Jesus still commissions these doubt-filled men in the next few verses.
Notice Jesus meets the disciples on a mountain in Galilee where he had appointed to meet them. We can't necessarily infer that it was their first encounter w/ the Risen Lord since the Gospel narratives give various "conflicting" first appearances to the 11 disciples.

Matthew also tells us the rumors were circulating as to the disciples committing a fraud. The powers thay be paid soldiers to spread word that the disciples had stolen the body and that reports of the resurrection were false. The story of fraud was believed by many because Matthew says the rumor still persists when he wrote his Gospel.

The disciples meet Jesus ... and they worship him but some while worshipping .... DOUBT. We don't know why they doubted ... humans often can see things even in front of their own faces and still doubt ... or perhaps they had doubts because they knew that He would be leaving them soon ... NONETHELESS ... THEY ARE WORSHIPPING THE RISEN LORD W/ DOUBT.

What is Jesus reaction to this?????

Does he complain ... does he rebuke them? Does he ask for a time out?

He could've said ... "You guys have to be kidding me!!! I told you I would resurrect and you're seeing me w/ your own eyes and YOU STILL DOUBT!!!!"

No ... he persists to re-assure them ... telling them that ALL AUTHORITY HAD BEEN GIVEN TO HIM ... and that they had his authority to go ... make disciples, baptize and teach the Word.
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  #70  
Old 06-16-2008, 09:47 AM
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Re: Is THIS a Sin?? ... Can it Ever Be?

6. Doubting Thomas

We ALL have a measure of faith, yet we also always, if you are HUMAN, wrestle with different levels or forms of doubt.

Thomas is given a bad rap for being a doubter, too. The term "DOUBTING THOMAS" has a negative connotation.

Simply because he asked "WHAT IF"??? Did Jesus condemn him because he needed to see to believe.

Thomas ....

He was open minded, in his doubt, that perhaps this was the Risen Lord. He just needed some proof. He was willing to believe something after examining the facts. A close minded person, unbeliever, would not even look at the facts or would just deny them.

Thomas was very much a believer even when he doubted. In a previous instance, Jesus has great admiration for Thomas.

The first story about Thomas we encounter is in chapter 11 of John. It is the story of Jesus’ raising Lazarus from the dead. Do you remember? Mary and Martha sent word to Jesus that their brother Lazarus was ill in Bethany. When Jesus got ready to go there the disciples threw a fit. They said, “Whoa Jesus. Don’t you remember the last time you were there you almost got stoned to death. And now you want us to go back there again. Jesus, don’t go there!”



Jesus told them flatly that Lazarus was no longer ill, but dead. Well if they were sort of thinking about risking their lives to go with Jesus to save a sick Lazarus, they sure weren’t going to risk their lives for a dead Lazarus.

In the midst of all this resistance, it is Thomas who speaks up and says to his fellow disciples, “Let us also go, that we may die with him.” To make such a statement required great faith in Jesus--and courage. Thomas was willing to lay down his life for Jesus. Why not call him Courageous Thomas instead of Doubting Thomas? Because of his courage, he and the disciples got to witness the miracle of Lazarus’ resurrection. Sort of makes you wonder why Thomas would have trouble with Jesus’ resurrection if he had witnessed the raising of Lazarus…. Yet he did.

What is Jesus reaction ???... definitely not the reaction we would have had w/ him ... or the disappointed religious stares we'd give him ...

There is no condemnation for his doubt rather Christ asks a fair question and acknowledges that Thomas DID BELIEVE.

All Jesus says:

Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here and see my hands, and bring your hand and put it into my side, and do not be unbelieving, but believe."

Thomas answered and said to him, "My Lord and my God!"

Jesus said to him, "Have you come to believe because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed."

Thomas was honest about his doubt ... and when he brought his doubt to Jesus ... he's rewarded w/ the unprecedented honor of touching his side and his scarred hands. His doubt in the hands of the Master is transformed to faith in His Deity.
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