Friends church droppped "standards"

[Jay]

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Nope, haven't paid any attention to the SU addresses.

Mom raised us boys, while having to work outside the home, but not always were her jobs 40 hrs/wk. This was done to help keep the budget balanced at home. She still works by cleaning other peoples homes, although she has also worked at grocery stores, cleaning a psychologist's office building, receptionist at a bed and breakfast/exotic animal farm, and other jobs that I have since forgotten. Some of these were done while actively being the pastor's wife. It does happen.

[UltimateUltraConservative]

Originally Posted by Jay

Mom raised us boys, while having to work outside the home, but not always were her jobs 40 hrs/wk. This was done to help keep the budget balanced at home. She still works by cleaning other peoples homes, although she has also worked at grocery stores, cleaning a psychologist's office building, receptionist at a bed and breakfast/exotic animal farm, and other jobs that I have since forgotten. Some of these were done while actively being the pastor's wife. It does happen.

Why'd ya quote me for!? lol

[Jay]

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Why'd ya quote me for!? lol

It made sense at the time?

[UltimateUltraConservative]

Originally Posted by Jay

It made sense at the time?

You gon' haff tuh quit havin' such a quick trigger finger!

[Jay]

It runs in my family. I can not help it. I was born this way.

[UltimateUltraConservative]

Originally Posted by Jay

It runs in my family. I can not help it. I was born this way.

Doesn't mean you have to stay that way. "There is deliverance in Jesus' name!"

[AreYouReady?]

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

I believe that the pastor sets the standards to a degree. Why be a pastor otherwise? I don't feel he's forcing it on me. I do it because I want to.

But, what about those who do not want to? The power of public opinion in the Pentecostal church is very powerful.

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

It also says in those passages "Whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister" and "whosoever will be chief among you let him be your servant." Isn't that what a good pastor does is minister to you, serves you, shows you the way? He's the watchman on the wall...I'll let him lead me. Him telling me to not wear pants, I don't have a problem with that. I don't feel I'm missing out on anything if I don't wear them. I already don't wear them simply because I LOVE my skirts!

No. Ministering is much more than standing behind a pulpit telling people what to do. Ministering is feeding the sheep with the word of God. Telling some female not to wear pants is not feeding the sheep. It is setting the agenda of what he wants the people to attend "his" church to do. Watchmen on the wall do much more than tell people what to wear, how to look, how not to look.

I don't have a problem with you wearing your skirts if you love them and simply want to wear them. You certainly are entitled to do that. The pastor is not entitled to tell anybody else they must wear skirts. There is no biblical scripture to support this no matter what OP churches say.

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

You're right...the pastor doesn't get the saints to heaven...but he is to minister to them...they can't hear without a preacher.

Can you read? Yes, I thought you can. Most people can read and do not always need to hear. There are many people that God can reach directly through the written Word and through the Holy Ghost.

I've always marveled at how no Pentecostal came to my home to witness to me, yet through prayer and asking the Lord for salvation, I found my way to a Pentecostal church, got baptized in Jesus Name and received the Holy Ghost. It was then that some there decided that I did not know anything and proceeded to tell me how I had to obey the pastor. How I had to quit cutting my hair and quit wearing pants. I marveled at how they burdened me instead of actually ministering to me. I had one pastor who told me that I was not allowed to leave his church until I married. HUH?

I don't buy it. The same Holy Ghost that led me to a Pentecostal church can lead and guide my life. That same Holy Ghost can keep me from leading a sinful life. Keep me from coveting, committing adultery, murder, lying, stealing, etc.

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Plumbing can be done in a skirt.

True. How many pentecostal women do you know work as a plumber and in a skirt? How many of them get into crawl spaces underneath homes and fix pipes?

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Hospital work can be done in a skirt.

True, but in the job I had I frequently had to change into scrub pants because I got blood, pus, feces, urine and vomit on me. I had to wear hose and slips along with those dresses and skirts. Why would I be condemned by my church if it is just easier to work 12 hours in pants than in hosiery, slips and skirts?

UUC, you are missing my point entirely in this conversation. My point is that many of you hollar religious freedom and religious persecution if your beliefs are violated by others. Yet when you people shun or not "use" others in church because of some dot or tittle violated in your uniform code, you do not view it as persecution. The OP church just change the words into "he watches for your soul" or "correction" to make it sound like the pastor is your benefactor. Or.. he is "serving" you by telling you how backslid you are for wearing a pair of pants. Or sit you down from the choir because you were "out of uniform"....until...one of their own family does it ...then the tone changes to "Well, let's just forgive and forget". Their own children are not backslid when they do the same thing that the pastors have punished someone else for. If I hadn't seen it countless times in the last 30 years, I wouldn't have believed it had somebody else told me this hypocrisy takes place. If I hadn't seen pastors mistreat people over this hair and clothing issue, then do an about face and allow it when their own little girls pull on slacks, cut their hair and wear makeup and jewelry and still pastor the church they made it miserable for others to stay in when they used to preach against it.

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Why would he refuse it? If it's honestly, morally and ethically earned...

You think it is ethical and moral for a man to take money from a woman who is trying to feed herself or her family? Some of them do work for their own living. I salute them. Some of them don't want their wife to work outside the home, but they have no qualms about taking money from another man's wife or worse yet, from a widow or divorced woman trying to feed her family?

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

You're right...wearing dresses only does not ensure modesty...it really doesn't matter what you wear, there is always opportunity for showing something of yourself if that's what you really want to do...

Thank you.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by UltimateUltraConservative

Doesn't mean you have to stay that way. "There is deliverance in Jesus' name!"

I'll amen that!

[AreYouReady?]

Originally Posted by Jay

Mom raised us boys, while having to work outside the home, but not always were her jobs 40 hrs/wk. This was done to help keep the budget balanced at home. She still works by cleaning other peoples homes, although she has also worked at grocery stores, cleaning a psychologist's office building, receptionist at a bed and breakfast/exotic animal farm, and other jobs that I have since forgotten. Some of these were done while actively being the pastor's wife. It does happen.

I am sure it does happen...just hasn't happened here that I have seen.

[UltimateUltraConservative]

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

But, what about those who do not want to? The power of public opinion in the Pentecostal church is very powerful.





No. Ministering is much more than standing behind a pulpit telling people what to do. Ministering is feeding the sheep with the word of God. Telling some female not to wear pants is not feeding the sheep. It is setting the agenda of what he wants the people to attend "his" church to do. Watchmen on the wall do much more than tell people what to wear, how to look, how not to look.

I don't have a problem with you wearing your skirts if you love them and simply want to wear them. You certainly are entitled to do that. The pastor is not entitled to tell anybody else they must wear skirts. There is no biblical scripture to support this no matter what OP churches say.




Can you read? Yes, I thought you can. Most people can read and do not always need to hear. There are many people that God can reach directly through the written Word and through the Holy Ghost.

I've always marveled at how no Pentecostal came to my home to witness to me, yet through prayer and asking the Lord for salvation, I found my way to a Pentecostal church, got baptized in Jesus Name and received the Holy Ghost. It was then that some there decided that I did not know anything and proceeded to tell me how I had to obey the pastor. How I had to quit cutting my hair and quit wearing pants. I marveled at how they burdened me instead of actually ministering to me. I had one pastor who told me that I was not allowed to leave his church until I married. HUH?

I don't buy it. The same Holy Ghost that led me to a Pentecostal church can lead and guide my life. That same Holy Ghost can keep me from leading a sinful life. Keep me from coveting, committing adultery, murder, lying, stealing, etc.




True. How many pentecostal women do you know work as a plumber and in a skirt? How many of them get into crawl spaces underneath homes and fix pipes?




True, but in the job I had I frequently had to change into scrub pants because I got blood, pus, feces, urine and vomit on me. I had to wear hose and slips along with those dresses and skirts. Why would I be condemned by my church if it is just easier to work 12 hours in pants than in hosiery, slips and skirts?

UUC, you are missing my point entirely in this conversation. My point is that many of you hollar religious freedom and religious persecution if your beliefs are violated by others. Yet when you people shun or not "use" others in church because of some dot or tittle violated in your uniform code, you do not view it as persecution. The OP church just change the words into "he watches for your soul" or "correction" to make it sound like the pastor is your benefactor. Or.. he is "serving" you by telling you how backslid you are for wearing a pair of pants. Or sit you down from the choir because you were "out of uniform"....until...one of their own family does it ...then the tone changes to "Well, let's just forgive and forget". Their own children are not backslid when they do the same thing that the pastors have punished someone else for. If I hadn't seen it countless times in the last 30 years, I wouldn't have believed it had somebody else told me this hypocrisy takes place. If I hadn't seen pastors mistreat people over this hair and clothing issue, then do an about face and allow it when their own little girls pull on slacks, cut their hair and wear makeup and jewelry and still pastor the church they made it miserable for others to stay in when they used to preach against it.



You think it is ethical and moral for a man to take money from a woman who is trying to feed herself or her family? Some of them do work for their own living. I salute them. Some of them don't want their wife to work outside the home, but they have no qualms about taking money from another man's wife or worse yet, from a widow or divorced woman trying to feed her family?



Thank you.

AYR...you make a lot of good points. I won't dispute that. I'm so sorry you've seen so many pastors abuse their position, mistreat saints, and have double standards. It's those pastors/preachers that give a good lot of them a bad name. I personally have family that are in ministry who are as 2-faced as they come and proclaim that preachers are only in it for the politics of it. To that, I say, "When did preaching become about the political game and now for the proclamation of God's word and helping to lead people to the knowledge of the truth?"

About the preacher comment I made before, the bible does say "How can they hear without a preacher?" And also says in 1 Corinthians 1:21 "...it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe." You found your way to a Pentecostal church...Now, in regard the people who took it upon themselves to tell you what you should do, how to dress and what-not, I do believe that God should have been the one to show you what He wanted you to do, or what he expected from you. I agree they shouldn't have done that.

God bless you, Sis!