Should we teach others to rebel against standards?

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Most Christendom just want to do as they very well please. No accountability, ESPECIALLY from Jesus Christ. Because after all He is invisible. Therefore since He isn't right there eye to eye with some of these toads, they continue to believe in a Jesus who hates everyone they hate. Who curses anyone they curse, who loves only the ones they love. Who agrees with them on every facet of their religious psychotic lives. But a physical eldership of ministers who will give you their unbiased point of view about behavior and life performance is VERBOTEN! They want smooth words, sweet love messages that make them feel good about being an ecclesiastical serial killer. Oh, they know the verses of their teachings, they can shuck the corn, and bale the hay with the best Judas/Absalom out there. They always know how to do it better than the elders of the church family. They can teach it better, they can preach it better, they can do everything just a wee bit better than guys who have been lifting the weight for literally years. But alas, David said that he almost slipped when he saw their prosperity, but he got it together when he relied their end. There has always been those who cut themselves off from any ministerial checks and balances. The Internet just made it more accessible for the wolves to join the pajama party, and teach everyone how they are all elders, bishops, apostles, evangelists, prophets, teachers, pastors, rabbis, gurus, shamans, warlocks and whatever other label they want to place on each other. 2 Timothy 3:6, Titus 1:11, Titus 3:3, and Jude 1:4.

totally agree

[coksiw]

I love, support and submit to my elders. I listen to their wisdom and preaching carefully, consider them to be called by God for their job. But I refuse all the unbiblical rhetoric of exaltation of the Pastor above measure, calling them implicitly or explicitly THE spokesman of God, or THE angel of God, or THE mediator between God and me. Pretty much they want to equate the prophets of old with the pastor, or Moses or a priest. They always forget that we are the body of Christ, all filled with the Holy Spirit, and He is the head. We are all priests, any of the assembly can be used to prophesy, teach and such.
Elders are there to set order and make sure the teaching is correct and everyone in the assembly is being fed. But that does not make them THE priest or THE prophet. That rhetoric is all false doctrine and self-serving, typical of cults.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by coksiw

I love, support and submit to my elders. I listen to their wisdom and preaching carefully, consider them to be called by God for their job. But I refuse all the unbiblical rhetoric of exaltation of the Pastor above measure, calling them implicitly or explicitly THE spokesman of God, or THE angel of God, or THE mediator between God and me. Pretty much they want to equate the prophets of old with the pastor, or Moses or a priest. They always forget that we are the body of Christ, all filled with the Holy Spirit, and He is the head. We are all priests, any of the assembly can be used to prophesy, teach and such.
Elders are there to set order and make sure the teaching is correct and everyone in the assembly is being fed. But that does not make them THE priest or THE prophet. That rhetoric is all false doctrine and self-serving, typical of cults.

What's your pastor like? How long have you known him? Has he ever said something that was going to happen and he nailed it? Ever seen the miraculous through his ministry? Not telling you to make him antichrist (someone in Christ's position) but just asking a legitimate question

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by coksiw

I love, support and submit to my elders. I listen to their wisdom and preaching carefully, consider them to be called by God for their job. But I refuse all the unbiblical rhetoric of exaltation of the Pastor above measure, calling them implicitly or explicitly THE spokesman of God, or THE angel of God, or THE mediator between God and me. Pretty much they want to equate the prophets of old with the pastor, or Moses or a priest. They always forget that we are the body of Christ, all filled with the Holy Spirit, and He is the head. We are all priests, any of the assembly can be used to prophesy, teach and such.
Elders are there to set order and make sure the teaching is correct and everyone in the assembly is being fed. But that does not make them THE priest or THE prophet. That rhetoric is all false doctrine and self-serving, typical of cults.

Brother, you are on a roll. Preach on.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

Would a ruler of the synagogue be considered a Pastor in todays realm?

Like EB says. No

The Hebrew church had pastors at the same time that the Jews had rulers of the synagogue. The rulers of the synagogue weren’t a type of the pastor. Neither were the priests a type of the pastors or preachers exclusively.

[coksiw]

The synagogues had a ruler called “the president” and then two more that would also rule. They were called elders. Then they had a small group of elders highly honored and respected, that were good examples to imitate, that would teach. Both, the rulers and the teaching elders were called “elders”. Then they had rabbis, highly distinguish teachers that were at times even considered like prophets. Then they have traveling rabbis (evangelist) and announcers (like a missionary?).

The church in the New Testament had some similarity, but no the same. The office of elders in the new testament is referred to as just one role: to rule and at least able to teach (even if not doing it actively). They were also financially supported by the same organized effort that supported the elder widows. See 1 and 2 Tim.

Justin Martyr mentioned once the “president” of the assembly, so there was an attempt before to incorporate that concept. I think that role ended up being called bishop.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by coksiw

I love, support and submit to my elders. I listen to their wisdom and preaching carefully, consider them to be called by God for their job. But I refuse all the unbiblical rhetoric of exaltation of the Pastor above measure, calling them implicitly or explicitly THE spokesman of God, or THE angel of God, or THE mediator between God and me. Pretty much they want to equate the prophets of old with the pastor, or Moses or a priest. They always forget that we are the body of Christ, all filled with the Holy Spirit, and He is the head. We are all priests, any of the assembly can be used to prophesy, teach and such.
Elders are there to set order and make sure the teaching is correct and everyone in the assembly is being fed. But that does not make them THE priest or THE prophet. That rhetoric is all false doctrine and self-serving, typical of cults.

Brother, you have the right to that opinion. Yet, when I read more negative then good, I disagree. I guess I must be from a different generation, I respect the office of the ministry. In my opinion, your on a dangerous path when you use with what your saying if you believe what your post. God can bless the church with gifts of the spirit, yet the ministry is set apart from the gifts. Your Pastor is held accountable for that assembly, he is the Angel of that city. I tread very carefully when how to deal with the man of God. Even Saul who was rejected from the Lord and David said “I will not touch the Lords anointed”, you what David did when that rejected king went after him? He ran, his heart smote him when he cut the garment. When Your Pastor is called to that local assembly he is anointed of God for that area. Try not to be critical of your Pastor, love him, pray for him, take his family out to eat, buy him something that you know he would like.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by coksiw

The synagogues had a ruler asl called “the president” and then two more elders that would also rule. Then they had a small group of elders highly honored and respected, that were good examples to imitate, that would teach. Then they had rabbis, highly distinguish teachers that were at times even considered like prophets. Then they have a traveling rabbi (evangelist) and an announcer (like a missionary?).

The church in the New Testament had some similarity, but no the same. The office of elders in the new testament is referred to as just one role: to rule and at least able to teach (even if not doing it actively). They were also financially supported by the same organized effort that supported the elder widows. See 1 and 2 Tim.

Justin Martyr mentioned once the “president” of the assembly, so there was an attempt before to incorporate that concept. I think that role ended up being called bishop.

Can I ask you a question? How do you read the Bible?

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

What's your pastor like? How long have you known him? Has he ever said something that was going to happen and he nailed it? Ever seen the miraculous through his ministry? Not telling you to make him antichrist (someone in Christ's position) but just asking a legitimate question

Humble, loving, great preacher. I call him, together with the assistant pastor, “my elders”. I love them a lot and have them close to my heart. I do disagree with them in few points they know but we still work together, get alone and carefully consider their teaching, advice and preaching. I do not need to worship them, to obey, support and submit.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by coksiw

Humble, loving, great preacher. I call him, together with the assistant pastor, “my elders”. I love them a lot and have them close to my heart. I do disagree with them in few points they know but we still work together, get alone and carefully consider their teaching, advice and preaching. I do not need to worship them, to obey, support and submit.

You should call him Pastor.