Can Apostolics be Democrats?

[ChristopherHall]

Just because one votes for a particular party it doesn't mean they agree with everything that party stands for. There are things on the Republican agenda that I don't agree with at all and I've voted Republican. So I think it's possible to be a devout Apostolic and vote Democrat. Sometimes some issues strike closer to home. If you've lost your family's income because your job was quickly moved overseas, if your family cannot afford health insurance any longer, or if you feel that unelected corporate power has become too great in Washington you might vote Democratic. Some of these issues have a more direct effect on our families than the issues of abortion or gay marriage. Nearly all of us stand against abortion and gay marriage...however our families must come first. Some Christians believe that you should secure your job, get health insurance for your family, and then maybe you can focus on righting the behavior of others.

When it comes to abortion there are really three views most religious people take in the Democratic Party:

Some believe that life doens't truly begin until the child breathes it's first breath. I don't think this can stand up to biblical scrutiny.

Some believe that abortion is morally wrong but feel that the government isn't the answer. Therefore they believe in preaching against abortion and allowing social conscience to fight abortion. Seeing that in 1997 the abortion rate was the lowest in American history (even lower than when abortion was illegal) this position has some merit to it. Change people's hearts and minds and though it may be legal few will choose abortion. Also Christian Democrats in this school of thought support programs and funding for programs that will assist women in crisis pregnancies to lessen the chances of them choosing abortion. One such Democratic initiative was promoted by the DFLA (Democrats for Life of America) called the 95-10 Initiative. It's aim was to reduce the abortion rate 95% in ten years...and that's without banning the procedure. Of course Republicans rejected the legislation. Some Christian Democrats also see that abortion and poverty have links. Two out of three women who procure abortion live below the poverty level. They note that their reason for choosing abortion is economic hardship. The theory is that many of these women are poor, scared, and acting out of fear. If measures to relieve poverty and assist women who may need it are there fewer will choose abortion.

Then you have the view of many Pro-Life Democrats that they want to eventually change the position of the Democratic Party on abortion and ban it in the US. They remain Democrats because they see too much corruption in the Republican economic system. They don't believe in Social Darwinist economics. They favor fair market over free market and they also may acknowledge that there are other issues like global warming and excessive war that are pressing.

So yes...I believe an Apostolic can be a Democrat. They just see things differently than their Republican brothers and sisters. If you're going to be a Republican...be the best Republican you can be. If you're going to be a Democrat...be the best Democrat you can be.

I'm a moderate so I don't claim to be a member of any political party. I vote for what will first benefit my family and second for those who will address the pressing issues of the day. If I felt that the most pressing issue is defense I'd most likely vote Republican. If I felt that the most pressing issue is the rising costs of health care on the American family...I'd most likely vote Democrat.

After so many years of Republican dominance we've not seen anything really impressive come out in regards to abortion and gay marriage. What can "government" really do about these issues? Banning abortion has never ended abortion. Nations in South America have banned abortion and still have some of the highest abortion rates in the world. However, Belgium is very liberal and abortion is legal...but it has one of the lowest abortion rates in the world. If government is the answer one would think the numbers would be the other way around.

As you can see there are some very different ways to look at the political issues of the day. I personally have no issue with Apostolic Democrats. I know and am good friends with quite a few of them.

[ChristopherHall]

Originally Posted by Sam

Hopefully this will not be considered inappropriate:


Subject: My Mommy The Dancer...

One day a fourth-grade teacher asked the children what their mothers did for a living.

All the typical answers came up -- teacher, nurse, businesswoman, saleswoman, doctor, lawyer, and so forth. However, little Justin was being uncharacteristically quiet, so when the teacher prodded him about his mother, he replied,

"Well my mother's an exotic dancer in a cabaret and takes off all her clothes in front of men and they put money in her underwear. Sometimes, if the offer is really good, she will go home with some guy and stay with him all night for money."

The teacher, obviously shaken by this statement, hurriedly set the other children to work on some exercises and then took little Justin aside to ask him, "Is that really true about your mother?"

"No," the boy said, "She works for the Democratic National Committee and is helping to get Hillary Clinton to be our next President, but I was too embarrassed to say that in front of the other kids."

You know...I don't think many caught the implications of the story.

[Light]

Originally Posted by dizzyde

What I don't understand is how the "christian" republicans can ignore all this stuff.

They have their head in the sand like the big bird. Facts don't matter to a republican.

[Light]

Originally Posted by Ferd

I hope you had one hand over your heart when you typed the words "Ronald Reagan"!

it is required you know.

Have no other God besides me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Esther]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Since the Democratic party platform is primarily liberal to the core, believing in:

Abortion on demand
Gay Marriage & gays as a special interest group
BIG government
More government control of citizen's lives
Silencing the Christian voice in America
Removing the 10 commandments

and a host of other causes that are un-biblical..........can a true Apostolic be a Democrat who believes in these things and please God?



Just wondering. This will be the first election that I will be voting as a registered Independent.

Matters not what party they belong to but if that is THEIR agenda, I can not vote for them.

[Light]

[Gen 6:6] And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

[Gen 6:7] And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

Gen 6:11] The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.

[Gen 6:12] And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.


[Mat 24:37] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

[Mat 24:38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

Do Republican Apostolics stand in the way of the will of God by the way they vote?????

[Apprehended]

Originally Posted by Light

[Gen 6:6] And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

[Gen 6:7] And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

Gen 6:11] The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.

[Gen 6:12] And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.


[Mat 24:37] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

[Mat 24:38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

Do Republican Apostolics stand in the way of the will of God by the way they vote?????

This is probably the least intelligent application of scripture that I have ever read.

OK, so I will answer anyway:

Yes, the Republicans DO. BUT, the Democrats are sanctified holy and would never think of doing such a thing. They all carry a bible in their coat pocket which they all consult and read before casting their sacred vote. God bless the Democrats and curst the Republicans...

THERE!

[ChristopherHall]

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

Since the Democratic party platform is primarily liberal to the core, believing in:

Abortion on demand
Gay Marriage & gays as a special interest group
BIG government
More government control of citizen's lives
Silencing the Christian voice in America
Removing the 10 commandments

and a host of other causes that are un-biblical..........can a true Apostolic be a Democrat who believes in these things and please God?




Just wondering. This will be the first election that I will be voting as a registered Independent.

I think it's important to focus in on definitions. The issues you presented are very important. However, sometimes things are in the eye of the beholder. It depends on how one looks at the issue. Let me list the issues you listed with a more moderate viewpoint that a Democratic Christian might have next to them:

Abortion on demand (The government has never successfully regulated abortion. With education and moral social pressure we have successfully lowered abortion rates in America to a 30 year all time low. Yes, lower than when abortion was illegal. No legislation necessary. Such would increase governmental power over the individual.)

Gay Marriage & gays as a special interest group (While homosexuality is morally repugnant it is a private matter the government shouldn't intrude upon. The government cannot regulate sexual behavior between two consenting adults, nor should it regulate "relationships" between free citizens. This issue is better left dealt with state by state as all marriage laws are. Such would increase governmental power over the individual.)

Silencing the Christian voice in America (This is typically a local issue and many Democrats see no issue with public expressions of faith as long as they are not funded with tax dollars or presented with the exclusion of other faiths.)

Removing the 10 commandments (Hanging a plaque on the wall of a court room or class room is a pat answer to a deeper problem. What we should be concerned with is why the Ten Commandments are not being taught by parents. It is strictly the role of the parent and the leaders of their faith communities to communicate and teach religious moral values. It is not the role of the state court system, the public school class room, or any other government agency.)

What is interesting is that the "conservative" would increase governmental power and control over the individual in these areas and have government take the place of moral and religious authority.

There has to be a balance that protects individual rights and freedoms (even if we do not agree with and even preach against their lifestyles). The limitations of Government must be acknowledged. Government has never been able to remedy issues like abortion. Loving faith communities that reach out to women in crisis pregnancies can do far more to save lives than push the lever for the "R's" ever election cycle.

As you can see, these issues look one way to the conservative and another way to the moderate and liberal.

[ChristopherHall]

I think the frustration with the Republicans is that they presented themselves as a religious and moral political party. The Democrats never made such a claim. Most Democrats acknowledge "personal religious faith" but believe that the role of government is one that is largely secular by it's very nature. By presenting themselves as a religious and moral party the Republicans have set themselves up for greater scrutiny. Especially now that they've done NOTHING on issues such as abortion and gay marriage. But rather they have worked on legislation that empties the coffers of government for corporate hand-outs, no bid contracts, and lined the pockets of their wealthy and powerful constituents.

[ChristopherHall]

If abortion and gay marriage were off the table (technically they are since both parties really don't plan to do anything about them)....which party would properly address the problems with international trade, free (but unfair) markets, multinational corporations that don't observe human rights in third world countries, the rising cost of health insurance, international diplomacy and the prevention of military hostility, the problems with pre-emptive war, the privacy rights of all Americans and the problems of the government's surveliance and wire tapping, exploitation and abuse of American labor, increased corporate money and power in the halls of government, and the list can go on.

I think the Republicans have been in office so long and the majority of Americans have lost faith that they will properly address so many of these important issues. So many Americans are looking at giving the Democrats a shot and seeing what good they might be able to to do. Remember, government works for us. If they don't do the job right we need to fire them and hire someone else. That's the only way to keep both parties activily trying to do their best. The problem is the Republicans count on us always voting for them like lemmings regardless of if we're loosing our jobs, can't pay for gasoline, can't pay for health insurance, can't pay for perscription drugs, etc. I think they've underestimated how far they can push Christian vote. I think that's why this thread exists. Something is awakening in our social conscience that is telling us that we need to punish the "R's" because they've really not done a good job and are taking our vote for granted.