Certainly there is some disconnect in condemning limited jewelry but embracing costly array. But I do believe that both miss the point that Paul was making. It's not about what you wear on the outside that matters most but the inside that counts. And so I enter this discussion believing that both jewelry and costly array may be ok given the right circumstances.
Nevertheless, I have got to admit that I am conflicted by the whole thing.
Dressing with Distinction
I do believe that the more "separated" from the fashions of the world; the more likely there will be a totally different culture in the church that occurs naturally as the body of believers creates their own society and ways to be legitimately noticed and recognized as distinctive from the uniform otherwise worn.
Is this all bad? Heavens no. Its refreshing to walk into the House of God and see good and wonderful people who are there to worship in their finest. It is so Norman Rockwell to walk into church as a family with one's Sunday attire that includes Rothchild coats for little girls and suits and ties for boys.
It is easy to bring your children up to live "above" the crowd at school when there is something wonderfully connected going on at church. It is like raising up royalty and isn't that what we are doing?
Toll on Visitors
HOWEVER....it is hard on visitors. And makes the visiting children stick out like sore thumbs. For some it works and when they come to Christ they can't wait to put on new clothes that signal they are part of that particular church body.
But for others; there is a discomfort that they can't get past. They won't be caught dead in a suit; even for their funeral.
And so we weigh traditional church clothes that promote a most wonderful feeling for those that wear them against the backdrop of welcoming others to place where they too can worship God without being embarrased by what they have to come to church in. There are no easy answers....
Message to Our Children
But I do believe we should cut the Conservatives slack who choose to worship God in their finest. It certainly sends a message to their children that isn't all bad.
The House of God is special as you are. No need to adapt to the lack of morality and lack of reverence of this world. Amen?
Newman you have legitimate points, but the mission of the church is not us, it is to be outward focused.
The house of God is special? Newman the house of God is you, not a building, the days of the temple and the specialness of sacred building are long gone, would to God people act and be as spiritual all week long as they do those 3 hours on Sunday.
Newman you have legitimate points, but the mission of the church is not us, it is to be outward focused.
The house of God is special? Newman the house of God is you, not a building, the days of the temple and the specialness of sacred building are long gone, would to God people act and be as spiritual all week long as they do those 3 hours on Sunday.
Oh yes he did, yet without sin, come on we are talking about packaging and presentation, do you actually thing that he could have influence without.
The whole of the incarnation is about becoming a man, to save man.
Excellent point!
Also, 'becoming all things to all men' doesn't mean Paul became a drunk to win drunks, or a prostitute to win prostitutes. It's more like, when in Rome, do as the Romans do.
I believe Paul adapted to the cultural and societal rules and mores so he would be more on their level instead of seeming to be above (or below) them, according to the culture he was visiting.
Jesus didn't travel outside of his country, but I don't believe He'd have done differently than Paul did if He had.
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
I have no argument with Jesus being God and man to save man, but being LIKE the people He was winning is incorrect.
If He became LIKE them, why did they need to change?
Did He step out of being God to invite them to be like Him and then they both stepped into the Godly realm together?
Now, as far as Him desiring them to be like Him, He did cause them to LIKE Him, which was accomplished by Him dealing with them on their level.
Is the above sentence what you are trying to say?
It is really is amazing people are unaware about the incarnational aspect of Jesus's coming. He came to a specific culture and enculurated himself into that culture, yet he was counter culutural. That is the tension. How do you live, become a part of a specific culture yet stand apart, we have made it about clothing, and things, I think we have missed the much deeper meaning.
We must become more like missionarys overseas, the worse thing a failing missionary will do is that they try do to is raise up a western style church.
This seed of the Gospel is so fertile and powerful that if you plant it within the soil of peoples dirty lives that fruit of holiness will comeforth, but first you have to be willing to get dirty.
Instead we open of the windows of our sacred spaces throw a little seed out and tell ourselves if people were really hungry then they would get out of the ground they are living in and come to our sacred spaces. WRONG, WRONG!
Newman you have legitimate points, but the mission of the church is not us, it is to be outward focused.
The house of God is special? Newman the house of God is you, not a building, the days of the temple and the specialness of sacred building are long gone, would to God people act and be as spiritual all week long as they do those 3 hours on Sunday.
I think in the context she was speaking, she is correct. We respect the building we are in even though we are the church. Even Paul spoke about respect and order in the church building....but he called it 'the church'.
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
It is really is amazing people are unaware about the incarnational aspect of Jesus's coming. He came to a specific culture and enculurated himself into that culture, yet he was counter culutural. That is the tension. How do you live, become a part of a specific culture yet stand apart, we have made it about clothing, and things, I think we have missed the much deeper meaning.
We must become more like missionarys overseas, the worse thing a failing missionary will do is that they try do to is raise up a western style church.
This seed of the Gospel is so fertile and powerful that if you plant it within the soil of peoples dirty lives that fruit of holiness will comeforth, but first you have to be willing to get dirty.
Instead we open of the windows of our sacred spaces throw a little seed out and tell ourselves if people were really hungry then they would get out of the ground they are living in and come to our sacred spaces. WRONG, WRONG!
Not sure what you are meaning in relationship to my post, but Jesus was in the culture of His time and lived accordingly..."Render unto Caesar..."
Perhaps we are on the same track here, but I am not sure.
Jesus went to where the people were, but his lifestyle was such that people wanted to change from what they were to what He was.
Don't know where the Western style church missionary enters in here...?
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