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  #1001  
Old 09-20-2021, 05:08 PM
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Scott Pitta Scott Pitta is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

JUST WHAT IS A REAL CHRISTIAN?
God wants only volunteer giving. We do not have to give. Giving la a privilege not of compulsion. We are the losers or gainers for eternity. There is a great recompense of reward. All we keep we lose. All give to God we keep. Nothing goes beyond the grave but the good we have done. This then should be the passion of our lives to live for others. An unselfish life is the only one that pays. All that is spent On self is lost. It perishes with the using. Souls are the only thing of real value. The only thing worthwhile is the opportunity of doing good today. Tomorrow even that is gone. In Eternity’s light we will despise the selfishness that caused us to miss it. Let us seek to help others toward heaven today. The man who lives not in the fight of eternity lives not at all. We can go to heaven a pauper and beggar if we will. Rewards are for sacrifice only not for selfish living. If we believe a hand shake, a kind word, or a needed gift may make the difference of heaven or hell for eternity for a soul how dare we withhold it? It will help them toward heaven Oh the poverty of a life lived for self! The only thing of value in the fight of eternity is the good deed done. Things withheld are lost forever But the future life is far too problematic with us. We believe only in the present material one that we can see Our five senses are our heaven.

Only those who like their Master are living wholly for God and others are real Christian. Like Jesus they are seeing how much they can give. He put His life into it. Only those who sacrifice will have reward. Seeking selfish blessings brings no reward. To follow Christ is not to see how much we can give without thought of getting. Such unselfish living gets the most. Let us give of our influence. We will receive fullness of joy for using our influence for souls. This a wonderful privilege and responsibility in living.

All the energy of the human race to live without God has been lost in all time spent in vain only to gain death and hell. A million dollars if secured could not add one hair’s weight to the life or joy of the soul. It could only feed and satisfy the animal man like the home or cow to perish with the using. Someone has said “God judges of what we give now by how much we give but rather by how much we keep for ourselves” Instance the “widow’s mite”. The rich young ruler went away sorrowful for he was very rich”. We are living our fives now. Let us do good today now before the opportunity is gone. If we really “seek first the Kingdom of God”. He will not fail us.

We shall receive reward for good or evil at compound interest. And who is able to compute it. It can be reckoned only at the final judgment. How careful we should be not to miss the opportunity for doing good. The fives we Influence today for right or wrong will touch other lives tomorrow with an influence that we can never recall. It Is like the waves of radio passing out into the other. Only its waves go on Into the lives of millions we cannot avoid it. Every life has this influence, this responsibility, and account to give this reward for good or evil which it cannot escape whether it wishes it or not. It is the price tor living of existence— Frank Bartleman (1929)
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  #1002  
Old 09-20-2021, 05:29 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Pitta View Post
JUST WHAT IS A REAL CHRISTIAN?
God wants only volunteer giving. We do not have to give. Giving la a privilege not of compulsion. We are the losers or gainers for eternity. There is a great recompense of reward. All we keep we lose. All give to God we keep. Nothing goes beyond the grave but the good we have done. This then should be the passion of our lives to live for others. An unselfish life is the only one that pays. All that is spent On self is lost. It perishes with the using. Souls are the only thing of real value. The only thing worthwhile is the opportunity of doing good today. Tomorrow even that is gone. In Eternity’s light we will despise the selfishness that caused us to miss it. Let us seek to help others toward heaven today. The man who lives not in the fight of eternity lives not at all. We can go to heaven a pauper and beggar if we will. Rewards are for sacrifice only not for selfish living. If we believe a hand shake, a kind word, or a needed gift may make the difference of heaven or hell for eternity for a soul how dare we withhold it? It will help them toward heaven Oh the poverty of a life lived for self! The only thing of value in the fight of eternity is the good deed done. Things withheld are lost forever But the future life is far too problematic with us. We believe only in the present material one that we can see Our five senses are our heaven.

Only those who like their Master are living wholly for God and others are real Christian. Like Jesus they are seeing how much they can give. He put His life into it. Only those who sacrifice will have reward. Seeking selfish blessings brings no reward. To follow Christ is not to see how much we can give without thought of getting. Such unselfish living gets the most. Let us give of our influence. We will receive fullness of joy for using our influence for souls. This a wonderful privilege and responsibility in living.

All the energy of the human race to live without God has been lost in all time spent in vain only to gain death and hell. A million dollars if secured could not add one hair’s weight to the life or joy of the soul. It could only feed and satisfy the animal man like the home or cow to perish with the using. Someone has said “God judges of what we give now by how much we give but rather by how much we keep for ourselves” Instance the “widow’s mite”. The rich young ruler went away sorrowful for he was very rich”. We are living our fives now. Let us do good today now before the opportunity is gone. If we really “seek first the Kingdom of God”. He will not fail us.

We shall receive reward for good or evil at compound interest. And who is able to compute it. It can be reckoned only at the final judgment. How careful we should be not to miss the opportunity for doing good. The fives we Influence today for right or wrong will touch other lives tomorrow with an influence that we can never recall. It Is like the waves of radio passing out into the other. Only its waves go on Into the lives of millions we cannot avoid it. Every life has this influence, this responsibility, and account to give this reward for good or evil which it cannot escape whether it wishes it or not. It is the price tor living of existence— Frank Bartleman (1929)
The interesting thing is that Jesus never asked people to give to him, but to the poor. However, many women supported him and his disciples.
Modern preachers when they get all on fire about giving is ALWAYS about giving to "ministry" which is basically for themselves, and NEVER to the poor in the congregation that may be driving a unsafe car, barely making it with SS, getting into credit card debt more and more because can't afford necessary things and services, or needing rides because can't afford a car, etc...
Once I heard a call to a Dave Ramsey show about tithing. This single mom said that when she gave tithing, she would get more and more in debt, but when she didn't she was able to make it. It was an eye opening call. It is easier to blame those poor among us by pointing to their past mistakes, but really, at the end the reality is that they are not been helped thanks to cynical excuses, while they asked in their heart "who sinned, she or her parents?". Nowadays, in the modern version of the Gospel, the poor is instead asked to give a substantial amount, and then they are given a promise of prosperity on the merits of obedience to the preacher's plea.
I hope those preacher asking for giving for "ministry" gets also on FIRE for the congregation to give to the poor among them, ... hoping they can still afford to do that after giving hundreds of dollars a month in tithing.

Last edited by coksiw; 09-20-2021 at 05:33 PM.
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  #1003  
Old 09-20-2021, 07:06 PM
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Nicodemus1968 Nicodemus1968 is online now
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
The interesting thing is that Jesus never asked people to give to him, but to the poor. However, many women supported him and his disciples.
Modern preachers when they get all on fire about giving is ALWAYS about giving to "ministry" which is basically for themselves, and NEVER to the poor in the congregation that may be driving a unsafe car, barely making it with SS, getting into credit card debt more and more because can't afford necessary things and services, or needing rides because can't afford a car, etc...
Once I heard a call to a Dave Ramsey show about tithing. This single mom said that when she gave tithing, she would get more and more in debt, but when she didn't she was able to make it. It was an eye opening call. It is easier to blame those poor among us by pointing to their past mistakes, but really, at the end the reality is that they are not been helped thanks to cynical excuses, while they asked in their heart "who sinned, she or her parents?". Nowadays, in the modern version of the Gospel, the poor is instead asked to give a substantial amount, and then they are given a promise of prosperity on the merits of obedience to the preacher's plea.
I hope those preacher asking for giving for "ministry" gets also on FIRE for the congregation to give to the poor among them, ... hoping they can still afford to do that after giving hundreds of dollars a month in tithing.
That’s a bit much to use the words, “always, and never”.
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  #1004  
Old 09-20-2021, 07:12 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 View Post
That’s a bit much to use the words, “always, and never”.
Blessed are your ears that heard something different! I have yet to hear a counter example in person (or on video). I have been going to church since 1998, and have lived in three countries. I have heard many preachers and many preachings about money. Maybe my memory is failing?

Last edited by coksiw; 09-20-2021 at 07:16 PM.
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  #1005  
Old 09-20-2021, 07:33 PM
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Nicodemus1968 Nicodemus1968 is online now
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
Blessed are your ears that heard something different! I have yet to hear a counter example in person (or on video). I have been going to church since 1998, and have lived in three countries. I have heard many preachers and many preachings about money. Maybe my memory is failing?
Do you believe saints should obtain wealth? To clarify, when I say saints, I’m meaning every believer in Christ.
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  #1006  
Old 09-20-2021, 08:04 PM
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seguidordejesus seguidordejesus is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

Wealthy saints, more complaints.
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  #1007  
Old 09-20-2021, 10:23 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 View Post
That’s a bit much to use the words, “always, and never”.
You know, Brother Coksiw is waaay more right than he is wrong. However, regardless, Jesus left us very specific instructions on how to give unto Him. His instructions are found in the lower half of the twenty fifth chapter of Matthew. I encourage you all to read it, the sermon of the sheep and the goats.

Jesus gives no less than six examples of giving just like it was to Him personally. He promises that the righteous people (the sheep) who give according to this example will inherit the kingdom of God.

On the other hand, those that don’t give to these charitable causes will be sorted out as goats, who are destined for everlasting punitive. It is verrry plain language. Yet, we almost never hear giving preached from Matthew 25. IMHO it is because preachers don’t really want you to give as unto Jesus, they instead want to encourage you to give to them or the “church” and pretend that you are “giving as unto the Lord”.

Neither the church or the pastor/preacher made the list that entails giving unto the Lord in Jesus’ lesson on giving. Preachers, by and large preach that most of your giving should be to preachers first and foremost, secondly they advocate giving to the church. If you still want to do some giving? Maybe they will eventually recommend the causes on the list Jesus gave. It will typically be a small amount that they allow you to give.

The tithing doctrine taught by most churches today didn’t come from the Bible. It came from the preachers and it is a self serving message.

I believe it could be a case of anemic faith in God, and misplaced and abundant faith in mammon. Which, when you think about it is really idolatry.
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  #1008  
Old 09-20-2021, 10:41 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
Blessed are your ears that heard something different! I have yet to hear a counter example in person (or on video). I have been going to church since 1998, and have lived in three countries. I have heard many preachers and many preachings about money. Maybe my memory is failing?
Preachers justify preaching about money by saying that Jesus did so. Have you heard the latest saying going around? It is that Jesus taught more about money than any other subject. Thus, they feel justified in preaching about money. And then they don’t really tell you what Jesus said about money! Why not?!

Because maybe they don’t want you to know about Him turning over the tables of the money changers! Jesus did a lot of teaching about money, one thing He taught is that it can be more important than it ought to be. It can arguably become your god. It can become so important that you ignore the very best sermon by the most qualified Preacher, in favor of coming up with another doctrine. Even erring from the faith.

1Tim.6

[10] For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
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  #1009  
Old 09-21-2021, 06:51 AM
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Nicodemus1968 Nicodemus1968 is online now
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
You know, Brother Coksiw is waaay more right than he is wrong. However, regardless, Jesus left us very specific instructions on how to give unto Him. His instructions are found in the lower half of the twenty fifth chapter of Matthew. I encourage you all to read it, the sermon of the sheep and the goats.

Jesus gives no less than six examples of giving just like it was to Him personally. He promises that the righteous people (the sheep) who give according to this example will inherit the kingdom of God.

On the other hand, those that don’t give to these charitable causes will be sorted out as goats, who are destined for everlasting punitive. It is verrry plain language. Yet, we almost never hear giving preached from Matthew 25. IMHO it is because preachers don’t really want you to give as unto Jesus, they instead want to encourage you to give to them or the “church” and pretend that you are “giving as unto the Lord”.

Neither the church or the pastor/preacher made the list that entails giving unto the Lord in Jesus’ lesson on giving. Preachers, by and large preach that most of your giving should be to preachers first and foremost, secondly they advocate giving to the church. If you still want to do some giving? Maybe they will eventually recommend the causes on the list Jesus gave. It will typically be a small amount that they allow you to give.

The tithing doctrine taught by most churches today didn’t come from the Bible. It came from the preachers and it is a self serving message.

I believe it could be a case of anemic faith in God, and misplaced and abundant faith in mammon. Which, when you think about it is really idolatry.
I undersatnd what you’re saying.

Yet, what do you think about the money “issue” in general for ALL believers.

Does money guide all of us? Do we understand how much we lean on that green paper or that card in our wallet or purse?

Let’s forget about preachers and ministry and ask ourselves if ANY believer should be wealthy? Ive heard saints that did not preach say, “I’m moving to this state because I was offered a better job making MORE money”. Ive heard testimonies in the church, how God bless this man/women with a new car! Really! The $25k, or $35k you spent on that vehicle could not that have gone to a homeless shelter, or maybe a believer in the church needed repairs on his vehicle, you couldve paid for it. Talk aout serving the god of their flesh. Believers work 40+ hours a week sometimes overtime to make that almighty dollar, yet some may pray 15 minutes a day. How can that work?

Those men and women of the bible gave everything they had for this work! Lets talk about all of us, should any or us be wealthy or should we seek first the kingdom and wait for God to give us everything else?

Matthew 6:25-34 KJVS
[25] Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
[26] Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?
[27] Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?
[28] And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:
[29] And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.
[30] Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith?
[31] Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?
[32] (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
[33] But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
[34] Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
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  #1010  
Old 09-21-2021, 08:23 AM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Who was Harry Morse ?

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Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 View Post
Do you believe saints should obtain wealth? To clarify, when I say saints, I’m meaning every believer in Christ.
1 Timothy 6:6-11 (NKJV) 6 Now godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and clothing, with these we shall be content. 9 But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and harmful lusts which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
11 But you, O man of God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness.


1 Timothy 6:17-19 (NKJV) 17 Command those who are rich in this present age not to be haughty, nor to trust in uncertain riches but in the living God, who gives us richly all things to enjoy. 18 Let them do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to give, willing to share, 19 storing up for themselves a good foundation for the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.


That's what I believe. The Bible is clear as water regarding riches.

When you purse wealth accumulation because of biblical wisdom (see proverbs), you don't overdo it, and you don't find pleasure in luxuries, because you are not pursing it as a way to obtain vainglory, and satisfy your lusts, but you are just doing your part of being diligent at work, and administering what God is giving you as result, and saving it for the "winter" times.

If God prospers you above measure in his grace, is for you to be even more generous and be rich in good works as the Epistles teach.
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