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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


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Old 07-25-2007, 07:46 AM
Digging4Truth's Avatar
Digging4Truth Digging4Truth is offline
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Letting The Word Speak vs Making The Word Talk

Now... from jump go I want to express that I am fully aware that what I am about to put forth here could be nothing more than a difference in the various ministries. As a teacher I may simply see things differently than an evangelist etc.

I was thinking last night about how some use the word of God in their ministry compared to others.

When some teach they tend to take the word and read from it and will then tend to attempt to discover what that portion of scripture was actually saying to us and break that down somewhat. Sometimes other scripture will tie to that scripture and sometimes there will be only one reading.

When others teach they tend to take the word and read from it and then take that scriptural reference and use it as a backdrop for a general lesson. They will sometimes also add other stories with similar themes and thread them throughout the sermon to fortify their thought.

In the first scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and being allowed to speak (assuming the teacher has a proper understanding of what the scripture was trying to say).

In the second scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and, for lack of a better word, "used" to make a point. Sometimes even used on an even keel of some other story, either real or imagined, that fortifies the point.

Is there anything wrong with either of these scenarios?

Is there any inherent danger with either of these scenarios?

Those who have been around longer than the rest of us... has this always been the way it has been? (as far as our own memory serves)

Does anyone know of any examples in the Bible where scripture was taken to make an overall point rather than taken to speak of what the word was actually written to say?

I look forward to your thoughts & Comments.
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Digging4Truth View Post
Now... from jump go I want to express that I am fully aware that what I am about to put forth here could be nothing more than a difference in the various ministries. As a teacher I may simply see things differently than an evangelist etc.

I was thinking last night about how some use the word of God in their ministry compared to others.

When some teach they tend to take the word and read from it and will then tend to attempt to discover what that portion of scripture was actually saying to us and break that down somewhat. Sometimes other scripture will tie to that scripture and sometimes there will be only one reading.

When others teach they tend to take the word and read from it and then take that scriptural reference and use it as a backdrop for a general lesson. They will sometimes also add other stories with similar themes and thread them throughout the sermon to fortify their thought.

In the first scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and being allowed to speak (assuming the teacher has a proper understanding of what the scripture was trying to say).

In the second scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and, for lack of a better word, "used" to make a point. Sometimes even used on an even keel of some other story, either real or imagined, that fortifies the point.

Is there anything wrong with either of these scenarios?

Is there any inherent danger with either of these scenarios?

Those who have been around longer than the rest of us... has this always been the way it has been? (as far as our own memory serves)

Does anyone know of any examples in the Bible where scripture was taken to make an overall point rather than taken to speak of what the word was actually written to say?

I look forward to your thoughts & Comments.

This is a hard question for me to answer, but I think the first is preferable...the second is ok perhaps if its qualified as a personal teaching...I think it's difficult for any preacher to not put his personal infulence on anything he preaches....

When ever I get into a dicussion of the Bible I always tell the person that what I am saying is my personal reading of a scripture, because God reveals different things to each of us in the time we need it...
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:46 AM
SDG SDG is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth View Post
Now... from jump go I want to express that I am fully aware that what I am about to put forth here could be nothing more than a difference in the various ministries. As a teacher I may simply see things differently than an evangelist etc.

I was thinking last night about how some use the word of God in their ministry compared to others.

When some teach they tend to take the word and read from it and will then tend to attempt to discover what that portion of scripture was actually saying to us and break that down somewhat. Sometimes other scripture will tie to that scripture and sometimes there will be only one reading.

When others teach they tend to take the word and read from it and then take that scriptural reference and use it as a backdrop for a general lesson. They will sometimes also add other stories with similar themes and thread them throughout the sermon to fortify their thought.

In the first scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and being allowed to speak (assuming the teacher has a proper understanding of what the scripture was trying to say).

In the second scenario, IMO, the word is being opened up and, for lack of a better word, "used" to make a point. Sometimes even used on an even keel of some other story, either real or imagined, that fortifies the point.

Is there anything wrong with either of these scenarios?

Is there any inherent danger with either of these scenarios?

Those who have been around longer than the rest of us... has this always been the way it has been? (as far as our own memory serves)

Does anyone know of any examples in the Bible where scripture was taken to make an overall point rather than taken to speak of what the word was actually written to say?

I look forward to your thoughts & Comments.
You present an interesting dilemma ...

If I know one thing ... it is that the Word is a seed ... no matter who is preaching ... their style ... delivery ... God gives the increase.

I know that many times you ask people what they got out of certain preaching/ teaching and you will get a multitude of answers. Sometimes you're not sure if they listened to the same message.

The Word ministers to us ... where we are ....

I guess my point is ... yeah sometimes a preacher/teacher can lead us to the water .... and at times its to point us to their viewpoint ... if its extrabiblical its dangerous ... yet how does he make it relevant and not boring?

Yet I feel if the Word has been presented ... and it never passes away ... it transcends our human delivery and the points we hoped to make...

when that seed is planted ... we often have no idea the power His Word has when it begins to germinate, bud, blossom and hopefully bear fruit... long after the preacher man said whatever he had to say.

The hearer also plays a role in this process ...

Quote:
After listening restlessly to a long and tedious sermon, a 6-year-old boy asked his father what the preacher did the rest of the week. "Oh, he's a very busy man," the father replied. "He takes care of church business, visits the sick, ministers to the poor.... And then he has to have time to rest up. Talking in public isn't an easy job, you know."

The boy thought about that, then said, "Well, listening ain't easy, either."

One thing that really makes hearing difficult is that what we already believe and feel affects what we hear.

Matthew 13:13-15
This is why I speak to them in parables: "Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand. In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: "'You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving. For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.' (NIV
17Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ.
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:59 AM
OP_Carl OP_Carl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth View Post
Is there anything wrong with either of these scenarios?
No, so long as the extrabiblical "stories" are delivered under the anointing and
with prayer and deliberation beforehand.

Quote:
Is there any inherent danger with either of these scenarios?
The first scenario risks boring people to tears, failure to communicate the intended message to those unfamiliar with the language of the bible, and failure to illustrate to the hearer how to apply the passages to daily life.

The second scenario risks emotionalism, doctrinal drift, and ministerial egotism.

Either one practiced exclusively could result in a church that never hears the plan of salvation, or never hears of God's judgments and commandments.

A good balance is crucial. The leading of the Holy Ghost is essential. That's why I want my pastor to spend time on his knees, not at the tees.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:05 AM
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Some of it is just preaching style. My husband tends to take the Word and break it down Scripture by Scripture, gleaning teaching from it as he goes through a passage. My brother, on the other hand, tends to take a thought from a verse and expand on the thought. They are both greatly anointed, but they are totally different. I don't think one is right and one is wrong.
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