God created our immune system

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

God made bacteria and viruses, molds and blights since He is the Creator of All that Is, so in a word, yes.

Do you have several examples of a sickness or disease as a judgment against a nation or nations for some sin by God, in the Bible? You used the word "often", so it should be a regularly occurring event, correct?

Are you thinking of Egypt? The Philistines and the hemorroids God gave them? Or something else?

As far as Israel is concerned, they were only plagued twice, once in Numbers and then again when David took a census. The first was supernatural, as the fiery serpents were actually seraphim according to the Hebrew. The second was through angelic agency, so again, supernatural, meaning not a sickness derived from a bacterium or virus

I think you named enough to validate my point, but I will post some scriptures on another comment.

No. Immune systems do not stay the wrath of God.

That wasn’t what I was meaning. The wrath of God was turned before, and as result he gave immunity. BTW, these are suggestions and not facts.

The general malaise of the human race and the sicknesses that it has experienced coupled with a longing to save ourselves from such suffering, in addition to continued advancements in technology and science, plus a willingness to forego believing such sicknesses were the result of divine justice, is what led man to discover the immune system, and other aspects of human biology and medicine.

If all sickness was created by God in response to the fall of man, than it is all a divine judgement. I believe that medicines have effectiveness, but most all have side effects. We come up with medical advances to increase mortality, but by curing one disease are we just creating another? One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it. I know I am not being very optimistic about all of this.

You might severely reduce infant and child mortality around the world for the first time in human history. But that isn't the real story of how inoculations occurred. It wasn't inject a child over and over again with all sortsof living contaminates and hope he survives.

Again, I think you are confusing inoculations with vaccines. Children the world over are given lots of vaccinations while they are young. But those vaccines do not carry inside of them divine plagues sent to judge the world, whatever else is in them

Emphasis on the word might. We really don’t know what the outcome would be. I personally am 40, and I have received a lot of the same vaccines that my children have. I am not posting this as medical advice. It is only something’s to consider.

You have to be able to show that such conditions as you have listed above are actually judgments from God upon this earth, from the Scriptures. Can you do that? Chapter and verse?

I believe I can

Doctors are like preachers, or anything else, really. Some are quacks, some are harmless but useless, some are mad, some are good and very helpful with correct moral motivations, and etc.

If a person wants to stay well they are better to eat healthy and moderately, excercise, rest, and most importantly obey God. Most people I know who routinely see physicians are being ripped financially and never get any better physically. There maybe a few exceptions.

But to think that we have the ability to harness a judgment from God in the form of disease in order to save ourselves from that judgment, means we have circumvented the power of God to do as He pleases, which just isn't possible. If God decides to judge, and if He decides to use a plague or sickness to do so, ain't no one gonna come up with an inoculation, vaccine, medication, treatment option, or other therapeutic or palliative that will make one iota of difference.

[Amanah]

Physicians are not paid to help you get well, they are paid for finding illness and writing prescriptions, and doing procedures.

[good samaritan]

Pestilence is used 48 times in the Old Testament, and in most every case it is either a warning from God or the fulfillment of a warning ( a judgement).

Leviticus 26:21-25
And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your high ways shall be desolate. And if ye will not be reformed by me by these things, but will walk contrary unto me; Then will I also walk contrary unto you, and will punish you yet seven times for your sins. And I will bring a sword upon you, that shall avenge the quarrel of my covenant: and when ye are gathered together within your cities, I will send the pestilence among you; and ye shall be delivered into the hand of the enemy.

Numbers 14:11-12
And the LORD said unto Moses, How long will this people provoke me? and how long will it be ere they believe me, for all the signs which I have shewed among them? I will smite them with the pestilence, and disinherit them, and will make of thee a greater nation and mightier than they.

Deuteronomy 28:15-22
But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee: Cursed shalt thou be in the city, and cursed shalt thou be in the field. Cursed shall be thy basket and thy store. Cursed shall be the fruit of thy body, and the fruit of thy land, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep. Cursed shalt thou be when thou comest in, and cursed shalt thou be when thou goest out. The LORD shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me. The LORD shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until he have consumed thee from off the land, whither thou goest to possess it. The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.

Jeremiah 21:1-9
The word which came unto Jeremiah from the LORD, when king Zedekiah sent unto him Pashur the son of Melchiah, and Zephaniah the son of Maaseiah the priest, saying, Enquire, I pray thee, of the LORD for us; for Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon maketh war against us; if so be that the LORD will deal with us according to all his wondrous works, that he may go up from us.
Then said Jeremiah unto them, Thus shall ye say to Zedekiah: Thus saith the LORD God of Israel; Behold, I will turn back the weapons of war that are in your hands, wherewith ye fight against the king of Babylon, and against the Chaldeans, which besiege you without the walls, and I will assemble them into the midst of this city. And I myself will fight against you with an outstretched hand and with a strong arm, even in anger, and in fury, and in great wrath. And I will smite the inhabitants of this city, both man and beast: they shall die of a great pestilence. And afterward, saith the LORD, I will deliver Zedekiah king of Judah, and his servants, and the people, and such as are left in this city from the pestilence, from the sword, and from the famine, into the hand of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, and into the hand of their enemies, and into the hand of those that seek their life: and he shall smite them with the edge of the sword; he shall not spare them, neither have pity, nor have mercy.
And unto this people thou shalt say, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I set before you the way of life, and the way of death. He that abideth in this city shall die by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence: but he that goeth out, and falleth to the Chaldeans that besiege you, he shall live, and his life shall be unto him for a prey.

Ezekiel 5:11-13
Wherefore, as I live, saith the Lord GOD; Surely, because thou hast defiled my sanctuary with all thy detestable things, and with all thine abominations, therefore will I also diminish thee; neither shall mine eye spare, neither will I have any pity.
A third part of thee shall die with the pestilence, and with famine shall they be consumed in the midst of thee: and a third part shall fall by the sword round about thee; and I will scatter a third part into all the winds, and I will draw out a sword after them. Thus shall mine anger be accomplished, and I will cause my fury to rest upon them, and I will be comforted: and they shall know that I the LORD have spoken it in my zeal, when I have accomplished my fury in them.

Amos 4:10
I have sent among you the pestilence after the manner of Egypt:
your young men have I slain with the sword, and have taken away your horses;
and I have made the stink of your camps to come up unto your nostrils:
yet have ye not returned unto me, saith the LORD.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Amanah

Physicians are not paid to help you get well, they are paid for finding illness and writing prescriptions, and doing procedures.

One of the few careers you get paid to practice.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Pestilence is used 48 times in the Old Testament, and in most every case it is either a warning from God or the fulfillment of a warning ( a judgement).

Leviticus 26:21-25
And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your high ways shall be desolate. And if ye will not be reformed by me by these things, but will walk contrary unto me; Then will I also walk contrary unto you, and will punish you yet seven times for your sins. And I will bring a sword upon you, that shall avenge the quarrel of my covenant: and when ye are gathered together within your cities, I will send the pestilence among you; and ye shall be delivered into the hand of the enemy.

Numbers 14:11-12
And the LORD said unto Moses, How long will this people provoke me? and how long will it be ere they believe me, for all the signs which I have shewed among them? I will smite them with the pestilence, and disinherit them, and will make of thee a greater nation and mightier than they.

Deuteronomy 28:15-22
But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee: Cursed shalt thou be in the city, and cursed shalt thou be in the field. Cursed shall be thy basket and thy store. Cursed shall be the fruit of thy body, and the fruit of thy land, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep. Cursed shalt thou be when thou comest in, and cursed shalt thou be when thou goest out. The LORD shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me. The LORD shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until he have consumed thee from off the land, whither thou goest to possess it. The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.

Jeremiah 21:1-9
The word which came unto Jeremiah from the LORD, when king Zedekiah sent unto him Pashur the son of Melchiah, and Zephaniah the son of Maaseiah the priest, saying, Enquire, I pray thee, of the LORD for us; for Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon maketh war against us; if so be that the LORD will deal with us according to all his wondrous works, that he may go up from us.
Then said Jeremiah unto them, Thus shall ye say to Zedekiah: Thus saith the LORD God of Israel; Behold, I will turn back the weapons of war that are in your hands, wherewith ye fight against the king of Babylon, and against the Chaldeans, which besiege you without the walls, and I will assemble them into the midst of this city. And I myself will fight against you with an outstretched hand and with a strong arm, even in anger, and in fury, and in great wrath. And I will smite the inhabitants of this city, both man and beast: they shall die of a great pestilence. And afterward, saith the LORD, I will deliver Zedekiah king of Judah, and his servants, and the people, and such as are left in this city from the pestilence, from the sword, and from the famine, into the hand of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, and into the hand of their enemies, and into the hand of those that seek their life: and he shall smite them with the edge of the sword; he shall not spare them, neither have pity, nor have mercy.
And unto this people thou shalt say, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I set before you the way of life, and the way of death. He that abideth in this city shall die by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence: but he that goeth out, and falleth to the Chaldeans that besiege you, he shall live, and his life shall be unto him for a prey.

Ezekiel 5:11-13
Wherefore, as I live, saith the Lord GOD; Surely, because thou hast defiled my sanctuary with all thy detestable things, and with all thine abominations, therefore will I also diminish thee; neither shall mine eye spare, neither will I have any pity.
A third part of thee shall die with the pestilence, and with famine shall they be consumed in the midst of thee: and a third part shall fall by the sword round about thee; and I will scatter a third part into all the winds, and I will draw out a sword after them. Thus shall mine anger be accomplished, and I will cause my fury to rest upon them, and I will be comforted: and they shall know that I the LORD have spoken it in my zeal, when I have accomplished my fury in them.

Amos 4:10
I have sent among you the pestilence after the manner of Egypt:
your young men have I slain with the sword, and have taken away your horses;
and I have made the stink of your camps to come up unto your nostrils:
yet have ye not returned unto me, saith the LORD.

So, instead of Preparation H, we just need to do 1 Samuel 6:5?

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

So, instead of Preparation H, we just need to do 1 Samuel 6:5?

I don’t know what to say about hemeroids. Chew your food better.

[Esaias]

Vaccines are a scam, they are bad for you, just say no.

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

I think you named enough to validate my point, but I will post some scriptures on another comment.

I named two instances. You wrote "often". Two instances in all of the Bible is "often" to you?

That wasn’t what I was meaning. The wrath of God was turned before, and as result he gave immunity. BTW, these are suggestions and not facts.

I recommend reading the book Missing Microbes by Martin J. Blaser. You will find that the physical material that makes up our bodies are only about a third actual DNA. The rest is bacteria. Our entire world is bacteria laden. It has been that way since the beginning of time. And so it is with us. God didn't create an immune system in us after the Fall. It was built in for the beginning.

If all sickness was created by God in response to the fall of man, than it is all a divine judgement. I believe that medicines have effectiveness, but most all have side effects. We come up with medical advances to increase mortality, but by curing one disease are we just creating another? One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it. I know I am not being very optimistic about all of this.

You are right, you are not being very optimistic. All sicknesses were not created by God in response to the fall of man. You cannot find that teaching the Scriptures.

As for cures. No new disease was created when small pox was cured, or when antibiotics were created and now, no one needs to die from the Bubonic Plague, or cholera, or typhoid, or many of the diseases of yesteryear that no longer continue to cause human suffering.

Emphasis on the word might. We really don’t know what the outcome would be. I personally am 40, and I have received a lot of the same vaccines that my children have. I am not posting this as medical advice. It is only something’s to consider.

I used the word "might" somewhat facetiously. The fact is, infant and childhood mortality have been radically reduced from where it was, say, during the Industrial Revolution, as cures for sickness were discovered. Penicillin, anyone?

I believe I can

Bon chance!

If a person wants to stay well they are better to eat healthy and moderately, excercise, rest, and most importantly obey God. Most people I know who routinely see physicians are being ripped financially and never get any better physically. There maybe a few exceptions.

Medical interventions due to lifestyle choices are by nature a consequence of those choices. But not everyone is healthy due to lifestyle choices. Some are born with disease and malady and didn't have a say in anything.

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Pestilence is used 48 times in the Old Testament, and in most every case it is either a warning from God or the fulfillment of a warning ( a judgement).

Leviticus 26:21-25
And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your high ways shall be desolate. And if ye will not be reformed by me by these things, but will walk contrary unto me; Then will I also walk contrary unto you, and will punish you yet seven times for your sins. And I will bring a sword upon you, that shall avenge the quarrel of my covenant: and when ye are gathered together within your cities, I will send the pestilence among you; and ye shall be delivered into the hand of the enemy.

Numbers 14:11-12
And the LORD said unto Moses, How long will this people provoke me? and how long will it be ere they believe me, for all the signs which I have shewed among them? I will smite them with the pestilence, and disinherit them, and will make of thee a greater nation and mightier than they.

Deuteronomy 28:15-22
But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee: Cursed shalt thou be in the city, and cursed shalt thou be in the field. Cursed shall be thy basket and thy store. Cursed shall be the fruit of thy body, and the fruit of thy land, the increase of thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep. Cursed shalt thou be when thou comest in, and cursed shalt thou be when thou goest out. The LORD shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, in all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me. The LORD shall make the pestilence cleave unto thee, until he have consumed thee from off the land, whither thou goest to possess it. The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.

Jeremiah 21:1-9
The word which came unto Jeremiah from the LORD, when king Zedekiah sent unto him Pashur the son of Melchiah, and Zephaniah the son of Maaseiah the priest, saying, Enquire, I pray thee, of the LORD for us; for Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon maketh war against us; if so be that the LORD will deal with us according to all his wondrous works, that he may go up from us.
Then said Jeremiah unto them, Thus shall ye say to Zedekiah: Thus saith the LORD God of Israel; Behold, I will turn back the weapons of war that are in your hands, wherewith ye fight against the king of Babylon, and against the Chaldeans, which besiege you without the walls, and I will assemble them into the midst of this city. And I myself will fight against you with an outstretched hand and with a strong arm, even in anger, and in fury, and in great wrath. And I will smite the inhabitants of this city, both man and beast: they shall die of a great pestilence. And afterward, saith the LORD, I will deliver Zedekiah king of Judah, and his servants, and the people, and such as are left in this city from the pestilence, from the sword, and from the famine, into the hand of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, and into the hand of their enemies, and into the hand of those that seek their life: and he shall smite them with the edge of the sword; he shall not spare them, neither have pity, nor have mercy.
And unto this people thou shalt say, Thus saith the LORD; Behold, I set before you the way of life, and the way of death. He that abideth in this city shall die by the sword, and by the famine, and by the pestilence: but he that goeth out, and falleth to the Chaldeans that besiege you, he shall live, and his life shall be unto him for a prey.

Ezekiel 5:11-13
Wherefore, as I live, saith the Lord GOD; Surely, because thou hast defiled my sanctuary with all thy detestable things, and with all thine abominations, therefore will I also diminish thee; neither shall mine eye spare, neither will I have any pity.
A third part of thee shall die with the pestilence, and with famine shall they be consumed in the midst of thee: and a third part shall fall by the sword round about thee; and I will scatter a third part into all the winds, and I will draw out a sword after them. Thus shall mine anger be accomplished, and I will cause my fury to rest upon them, and I will be comforted: and they shall know that I the LORD have spoken it in my zeal, when I have accomplished my fury in them.

Amos 4:10
I have sent among you the pestilence after the manner of Egypt:
your young men have I slain with the sword, and have taken away your horses;
and I have made the stink of your camps to come up unto your nostrils:
yet have ye not returned unto me, saith the LORD.

Brother, you wrote that you could prove from the Scriptures that such autoimmune disorders as...

Allergies, asthma, eczema, and many more I don’t know the name of. Maybe even more severe things, like some of the mental illness we have discussed on other threads

...are judgments from God. Where in the above verses of Scripture do you see anything as specific as allergies, eczema, or etc.?

Methinks you read too much between the lines and therefore miss the lines entirely, seeing only what you already want to see.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

If God wants you dead, you will be deader than cold fried chicken. No matter what you do will stay His hand.

Go play in the road.