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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


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Old 07-16-2007, 01:57 PM
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Pastor Keith Pastor Keith is offline
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The Correct Way to Baptize....

With all the discussion about baptism over the last few days, thought I would share some tidbits about baptism, some of what we do regarding baptism is from tradition and you know what they say about it that...

The first tidbit is that the person being baptized called on the name of the Lord, not the one doing the baptizing Acts 22:16.

I think that something is missing because the person who is being baptized sometimes misses this important element of calling on the Name of Jesus to wash them from their sins

The second part is that this I believe fulfills Romans 10:9

The third tidbit, is that of course the Jews understood baptism to be part of the washing rituals from their history of purification washings, but there is a new twist that the Romans understood about loyalty and oaths, that baptism also gave a picture of a soldier pledging ownership and loyalty to his new master (Pawson, The Normal Christian Birth)

Another tidbit about baptism that I never saw until recently, was in Luke's account of Jesus's baptism, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon him for the sake of ministry/to fulfill the type of the baptism of the Spirit, until he prayed, here is what Luke records....

Luke 3:21 When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying (Jesus), heaven was opened
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Old 07-16-2007, 02:07 PM
Chan
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Originally Posted by keith4him View Post
With all the discussion about baptism over the last few days, thought I would share some tidbits about baptism, some of what we do regarding baptism is from tradition and you know what they say about it that...

The first tidbit is that the person being baptized called on the name of the Lord, not the one doing the baptizing Acts 22:16.

I think that something is missing because the person who is being baptized sometimes misses this important element of calling on the Name of Jesus to wash them from their sins

The second part is that this I believe fulfills Romans 10:9

The third tidbit, is that of course the Jews understood baptism to be part of the washing rituals from their history of purification washings, but there is a new twist that the Romans understood about loyalty and oaths, that baptism also gave a picture of a soldier pledging ownership and loyalty to his new master (Pawson, The Normal Christian Birth)

Another tidbit about baptism that I never saw until recently, was in Luke's account of Jesus's baptism, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon him for the sake of ministry/to fulfill the type of the baptism of the Spirit, until he prayed, here is what Luke records....

Luke 3:21 When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying (Jesus), heaven was opened
It certainly seems to contradict the notion of the baptizer pronouncing words over someone like some sort of magical incantation!
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Old 07-16-2007, 02:47 PM
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Monkeyman Monkeyman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keith4him View Post
With all the discussion about baptism over the last few days, thought I would share some tidbits about baptism, some of what we do regarding baptism is from tradition and you know what they say about it that...

The first tidbit is that the person being baptized called on the name of the Lord, not the one doing the baptizing Acts 22:16.

I think that something is missing because the person who is being baptized sometimes misses this important element of calling on the Name of Jesus to wash them from their sins

The second part is that this I believe fulfills Romans 10:9

The third tidbit, is that of course the Jews understood baptism to be part of the washing rituals from their history of purification washings, but there is a new twist that the Romans understood about loyalty and oaths, that baptism also gave a picture of a soldier pledging ownership and loyalty to his new master (Pawson, The Normal Christian Birth)

Another tidbit about baptism that I never saw until recently, was in Luke's account of Jesus's baptism, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon him for the sake of ministry/to fulfill the type of the baptism of the Spirit, until he prayed, here is what Luke records....

Luke 3:21 When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying (Jesus), heaven was opened
Thanks for posting Keith. As usual, you make the reader want to go and study! When will you write a book? I will be first in line to buy it!!!
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Old 07-16-2007, 03:03 PM
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Here we go again ... the topic of pronouncement ... THE REMIX!!!
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Old 07-16-2007, 03:27 PM
Ronzo
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Originally Posted by keith4him View Post
The first tidbit is that the person being baptized called on the name of the Lord, not the one doing the baptizing Acts 22:16.
Correct. In addition, "in the name of" meant "in the authority of the one who the name represents".


Quote:
I think that something is missing because the person who is being baptized sometimes misses this important element of calling on the Name of Jesus to wash them from their sins
Baptism waters do not wash away sin. The Blood of Jesus does. The Blood is not 'applied' in baptism.

Quote:
The second part is that this I believe fulfills Romans 10:9
I guess that could be argued as public baptism was a pretty heavy way of making the statement that you identified with Christ (or any other movement) to the 1st Century Jew... and even to the Gentile at the time.



Quote:
The third tidbit, is that of course the Jews understood baptism to be part of the washing rituals from their history of purification washings, but there is a new twist that the Romans understood about loyalty and oaths, that baptism also gave a picture of a soldier pledging ownership and loyalty to his new master (Pawson, The Normal Christian Birth)
Never heard that about the Roman soldier, etc, but before a Jewish couple consumated their wedding (as they were already married upon the bride's acceptance of the groom's proposal), the bride went through a ceremonial washing.

Quote:
Another tidbit about baptism that I never saw until recently, was in Luke's account of Jesus's baptism, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon him for the sake of ministry/to fulfill the type of the baptism of the Spirit, until he prayed, here is what Luke records....
Jesus was baptized for His taking on the role of High Priest, and anointed as High priest and King by the Holy Ghost.
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Old 07-16-2007, 03:32 PM
Chewy
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99% of all people baptized, at least in my experience, are scriptural and spiritual infants and thus do not know or understand the the depth of what their baptism means, names being said, what to think, what to say, what to do and all having a cultural point of reference, during the whole process.

Unfortunately, many Apostolics turn baptisms into religious propaganda instead of making it about the person being baptized. They look it as one more person being converted into the church and TRUTH instead of one person starting a brand new life in the Lord Jesus. This is why only a small percentage of folks baptized stick beyond one year or beyond.
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Old 07-21-2007, 07:37 PM
SDG SDG is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keith4him View Post
With all the discussion about baptism over the last few days, thought I would share some tidbits about baptism, some of what we do regarding baptism is from tradition and you know what they say about it that...

The first tidbit is that the person being baptized called on the name of the Lord, not the one doing the baptizing Acts 22:16.

I think that something is missing because the person who is being baptized sometimes misses this important element of calling on the Name of Jesus to wash them from their sins

The second part is that this I believe fulfills Romans 10:9

The third tidbit, is that of course the Jews understood baptism to be part of the washing rituals from their history of purification washings, but there is a new twist that the Romans understood about loyalty and oaths, that baptism also gave a picture of a soldier pledging ownership and loyalty to his new master (Pawson, The Normal Christian Birth)

Another tidbit about baptism that I never saw until recently, was in Luke's account of Jesus's baptism, the Holy Spirit did not descend upon him for the sake of ministry/to fulfill the type of the baptism of the Spirit, until he prayed, here is what Luke records....

Luke 3:21 When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying (Jesus), heaven was opened
I don't know Keith but you're sounding more and more PCI ...

first it was we're justified at repentance an now this ...
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Old 07-21-2007, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewy View Post
99% of all people baptized, at least in my experience, are scriptural and spiritual infants and thus do not know or understand the the depth of what their baptism means, names being said, what to think, what to say, what to do and all having a cultural point of reference, during the whole process.

Unfortunately, many Apostolics turn baptisms into religious propaganda instead of making it about the person being baptized. They look it as one more person being converted into the church and TRUTH instead of one person starting a brand new life in the Lord Jesus. This is why only a small percentage of folks baptized stick beyond one year or beyond.
BINGO!!!!!!




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Folks, we have a winner here!!!
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Old 07-21-2007, 08:11 PM
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Sam Sam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewy View Post
99% of all people baptized, at least in my experience, are scriptural and spiritual infants and thus do not know or understand the the depth of what their baptism means, names being said, what to think, what to say, what to do and all having a cultural point of reference, during the whole process.

Unfortunately, many Apostolics turn baptisms into religious propaganda instead of making it about the person being baptized. They look it as one more person being converted into the church and TRUTH instead of one person starting a brand new life in the Lord Jesus. This is why only a small percentage of folks baptized stick beyond one year or beyond.
I am on the prayer team for the Monday Night Growth and Healing meetings at the Vineyard Church in Springdale, OH. Springdale is a city in the northern part of Hamilton County here in the Greater Cincinnati area of Ohio. It is to the north and east of the city of Forest Park where I live. A young man (in his forties) is in one of the small groups at the Vineyard and has been going to the Vineyard for several years. We often talk and and some times he asks me to pray for him. A while back he told me that he had been to the Calvary Church on Kenn Road and that he had been baptized there. I asked him what name they baptized him in or what they said when they baptized him and he did not remember. Calvary Church is in Springdale and is near his home in Forest Park. The pastor is Norman Paslay (son of the late Norman and Mary Alice Paslay). It is a UPC church and has been since it was established in 1968. I knew the Paslays. They were assistant pastors in the church where I went from 1957 to 1963 or 64.

My whole point is just to agree with what was posted by Chewy above. This young man was baptized in Jesus' name but had no idea that his baptism was anything different than any other immersion that he had seen any where else.
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Old 07-21-2007, 08:15 PM
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