Holiness vs. Legalism

[larrylyates]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

Correct......... but even then it is as Paul said they speak in a mystery and Solomon spoke of how God has hidden the truths but "kings" seek them out

Mark 4:11
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

Romans 16:24-26
24 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

1 Corinthians 2:7
But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

Ephesians 1:9
Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Ephesians 3:4
Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

Colossians 1:26
Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

John 15:15
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

1 John 2:20-21
20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

1 John 2:27
But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

The NT use of the word mystery (G3466 μυστήριον musterion) is that of a secret once hidden but now revealed unto us by the Holy Spirit. Paul did not say we "speak in a mystery," he said "we speak the wisdom of God." We cannot speak what we do not understand. That is why the Holy Spirit was given, to guide us into all truth. We "need not that any man teach" us, the anointing of the Holy Spirit teaches us of ALL things.

There is nothing hidden from the child of God. All things are revealed to us by His Spirit through the Scriptures.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by larrylyates

...There is nothing hidden from the child of God. All things are revealed to us by His Spirit through the Scriptures.

Hey, something we can (categorically, at least) agree on! (there are still some things hidden from us tho, according to Scripture)

[larrylyates]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Hey, something we can (categorically, at least) agree on! (there are still some things hidden from us tho, according to Scripture)

We're not ALWAYS in disagreement. You say a lot of things that I agree with. For you, perhaps not so much in my case.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Esaias

So God's truth is not being taught anywhere except by you, Doug, in your book?

Do I understand you correctly?

Did I say that

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by larrylyates

Mark 4:11
And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

Romans 16:24-26
24 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

1 Corinthians 2:7
But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

Ephesians 1:9
Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Ephesians 3:4
Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

Colossians 1:26
Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:

John 15:15
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

1 John 2:20-21
20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

1 John 2:27
But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

The NT use of the word mystery (G3466 μυστήριον musterion) is that of a secret once hidden but now revealed unto us by the Holy Spirit. Paul did not say we "speak in a mystery," he said "we speak the wisdom of God." We cannot speak what we do not understand. That is why the Holy Spirit was given, to guide us into all truth. We "need not that any man teach" us, the anointing of the Holy Spirit teaches us of ALL things.

There is nothing hidden from the child of God. All things are revealed to us by His Spirit through the Scriptures.

If there is nothing hidden why are there are 30,000 different denominations of Christianity all teaching different doctrines?

[larrylyates]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

If there is nothing hidden why are there are 30,000 different denominations of Christianity all teaching different doctrines?

Are you denying the Authority and Inspiration of the Scriptures? I ask because all of the Scriptures I listed prove that there is nothing hidden from the child of God and that we were given the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth and have no need that any man teach us.

Your question is an evasion not answer. Are you denying the Inspiration and Authority of Scripture?

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by larrylyates

Are you denying the Authority and Inspiration of the Scriptures? I ask because all of the Scriptures I listed prove that there is nothing hidden from the child of God and that we were given the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth and have no need that any man teach us.

Your question is an evasion not answer. Are you denying the Inspiration and Authority of Scripture?

Larry,

For the 2nd time since I have been here I rebuke you in Jesus name! To the best of my memory I have only said this to one other person one other time in my life.

One of the things I have made very clear in the beginning of my book is that the Bible is the only place that is to be used as an authority for the word of God.

Doug

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

If there is nothing hidden why are there are 30,000 different denominations of Christianity all teaching different doctrines?

Does the cat have your tongue?

Please answer my question and quit being evasive!

Do you have mysteries figured out, do you think you have the keys to the kingdom?

Can you prove your faith with works? In other words and said very simply have through your prayers alone the sick been healed or have the the dead been raised?

Because if you have it right, there is no reason for God not to witness your ministry with signs and wonders that can only be done by God.

However, if you do not have a right there is every reason for God not to bless your ministry

Just saying ....

[larrylyates]

[QUOTE=Livelystone;1250814]Larry,

For the 2nd time since I have been here I rebuke you in Jesus name! To the best of my memory I have only said this to one other person one other time in my life.

Actually, Doug you have rebuked two of us on here.

One of the things I have made very clear in the beginning of my book is that the Bible is the only place that is to be used as an authority for the word of God.

None of us have your book, although I have read the preview. All we have are your statements on these threads, which are sometimes, not as clear as you perhaps intend.

To rebuke someone in the Name of the Lord is a very serious matter. May I ask, what it is in the above posts that has earned me such a stern reprimand?

I simply quoted the Bible to you after which you responded in a way that seemed to have shown that you did not like or agree with the implications of those Scriptures. I merely asked you if you did or did not accept the Authority and Inspiration of Scripture. a fairly common question.

It was really not said to you in an attacking way. I simply was curious, because several times you have seemed to indicate that there are things in your book that are not being taught anywhere else. You imply that you came back from the dead with a mission from God. I think that is wonderful and do not question it's reality to you. But you also seem to imply that you have a special revelation that no one else apparently has. You have been questioned on this a number of times by different people, in different Threads. Each time your answer is a bit defensive if not outright hostile in my case.

I guess what troubles me is that no one can quite seem to figure out exactly what you are trying to say. When asked if you were indeed teaching what can only be found in your book, you were very evasive. That concerned me because a teacher of God has a responsibility given to him by God for which he is held accountable. That is why Paul cautioned us that we should be very careful before embarking on that path. We will be held to a higher standard.

So, seeing as how all I did was provide you with Scriptural proof that there are no revelations or mysteries that are hidden from the Spirit-filled Child of God, why to you find it necessary to rebuke me. As I said, I never once in this thread have attacked you personally.

As for your question concerning the existence of so many different denominations, that should be obvious to any student of the Word of God. The Holy Spirit was given to guide us into all truth. If a group for some reason, denies or rejects the operation of the Spirit, they will fall into error. If another group for some reason decides that they don't agree with certain teachings of Scripture and chooses to ignore them or explain them away, they will fall into error. If another, or in this case many such groups decide to follow the teachings of a particular man;Calvinists, Lutherans. Russelites, Campbellites, followers of Joseph Smith, etc. They too will be led into error. That's not so difficult to understand.

You seemed to imply that you possess an understanding that no one else has, but that can be obtained by reading your book. Is that what you meant to imply? Perhaps you simply were not clear in what you said, but that is the impression you have given to a number of us and that is why we have asked the questions we have asked you. Seeking clarification and understanding. I notice you don't respond well to that. That puzzled me and when you said what you did about mysteries, which used the word in a way the Bible does not, I responded by offering you the Scriptures which would help others understand what the Word of God actually says about such matters.

I apologize if you found my words offensive, they all were simply lifted from the pages of Scripture? Is there a particular Scripture that I somehow misquoted that caused the rebuke? Was it my desire to know your position o the Inspiration and authority of Scripture? you see I am confused by your response. It troubles me.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

Did I say that

Here is what you said:

Originally Posted by Livelystone

Because Christ did not sin and cannot sin the way to overcoming sin is to have Christ in our hearts 24/7.

However, for that to happen we first have to know the absolute truth of the foundational doctrines listed in Hebrews 6:1–2 that cannot be known without first knowing how to apply the laws spiritually. For that matter we cannot even determine true doctrinal knowledge without first knowing how to use the laws for determining the truth.

You made several assertions:

1. The way to overcoming sin is to have Christ in our hearts 24/7. Obviously, if someone doesn't have Christ in their heart they are not saved.

2. However, for that to happen we first have to know the absolute truth of the foundational doctrines listed in Hebrews 6:1–2...
You assert that knowing the 'absolute truth of the doctrines listed in Hebrews 6:1-2' is a requirement for having Christ in their hearts 24/7.

3. ...listed in Hebrews 6:1–2 that cannot be known without first knowing how to apply the laws spiritually.
You then assert that #2 cannot be accomplished without first knowing 'how to apply the laws spiritually'.
So then, one must first know how to apply the laws spiritually, then 2nd know the absolute truth of Hebrews 6:1-2, which will lead to christ being in the heart 24/7.

4. For that matter we cannot even determine true doctrinal knowledge without first knowing how to use the laws for determining the truth.
Here you claim that we can do any of that without 'first knowing how to use the laws for determining truth'.

So then you claim we must 1st know how to use the 'laws for determining truth', then 2nd know how to apply the laws spiritually, then know the absolute truth of Hebrews 6:1-2, then we will have Christ in our hearts 24/7.

With me so far?

But you also said this:

I am not trying to sell you a book but there is no other place where what I say is being taught by anyone else.

Thus, if you are teaching the Truth about how to use the laws for determining truth, how to apply the laws spiritually, and the knowledge of the absolute truth of Hebrews 6:1-2, AND nobody else is teaching those things, then nobody is teaching God's Truth except you.

I am going to skip over your brief infomercial for your book and just leave it at this.