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Old 05-14-2021, 09:17 AM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphasis?

When people die, their soul go to a place to await resurrection. This place was referred to as the Hebrew word Sheol in the Old Testament. This word was translated into Greek in the New Testament as Hades. In the literal sense means ``grave'', but it its figurative sense refers to the afterlife place. Sheol or Hades is the adobe of the dead, the just and the unjust; however, they are separated inside Luke 16:22-23. The word Hades can also refer exclusively in a negative sense to the adobe of the wicked where they are tormented with infernal fire Luke 16:23.

Some people in this forum will disagree with me in the existence of a conscious soul after death going into a place, but that's OK . But for those that do, let me continue with my point.

Jesus did not talk much about Hades. The three passages in the Gospels were Jesus mentioned it are in Matthew 11:23 (parallel passage in Luke 10:15) referring to a judgment on a city; then Matthew 16:18 in response to Peter's confession; and then finally in Luke 16:22-23, where he details the condition of the wicked in that place. Jesus also refers to the place where the departed souls of the believers go as ``paradise'' in Luke 23:43. Hades is not yet the place of eternal destruction, so it is not yet the place of the actual eternal judgment.

There is another word that it is usually translated as ``hell'', or ``hell fire'' that refers to the eternal destruction. The Greek word is Gehenna, literally, the waste landfill outside of Jerusalem, figuratively, hell fire. This place is described as a place where destruction does not end, where there is an unquenchable fire, and where worm never dies Mark 9:43-44.
The Gospels, and Jesus himself does refer directly or through allusions to this place in many places. The word Gehenna alone appears 11 times in the Gospel, and there are at least 21 times it is referred to with allusions like fire, unquenchable fire, everlasting fire, everlasting punishment, furnace of fire, worm does not die. The ones that did not believe the Gospel will be resurrected, and judged according to their works, and thrown alive into this place as described in Revelation 20:11-15.

It is important to understand that nobody, through the entirety of human history, will be able to escape from this. The Gospels give to eternal judgment a front seat regarding relevance, more than Hades itself. Everybody will stand one day before God and be accountable to what they did with the Gospel, and their lives. In that day, nothing else will matter: fame, society acceptance, fear of men, wealth, dead works, friends and family, you name it. It will be each soul and God in a time of accountability. That is the day when everything that is secret will be revealed, and everything that is hidden will come to light Luke 8:17, Matthew 10:26, Luke 12:2, I Corinthians 4:5.

As a matter of contrast, everlasting life has more than three dozen mentions and allusions in the Gospels alone. I didn't count them all.

The more we understand what we are being saved from, the more we go on our knees grateful of this great salvation, and the mercies of God.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16 (NKJV)


Therefore, more than putting emphasis on hell as in Hades as the destiny of the wicked in evangelistic messages, the Gospel wants us to put the emphasis in eternal judgment where people stand before God, and in Gehenna, and in everlasting life.

Last edited by coksiw; 05-14-2021 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 05-14-2021, 12:02 PM
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Amanah Amanah is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

Our focus is to return to the garden (via resurection from death/hell/and the grave) to eat from the tree of life (eternal life) in Revelation 22.
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Old 05-14-2021, 12:52 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by Amanah View Post
Our focus is to return to the garden (via resurection from death/hell/and the grave) to eat from the tree of life (eternal life) in Revelation 22.
Sis our ultimate emphasis should be the message of hope: the solution to the problem.

My point is about some people that in their evangelistic message talk about the destiny of the wicked centered in where you go after you die: heaven(paradise) or hell(like a prison in Hades). Instead, if we are going to talk about the destiny of the wicked (or the just) in a message it should be about the day they stand before God alive and being accountable to Him, and then judged.

There is also a lot of misinterpretation, associating passages related to eternal judgment with Hades, because some translations calls it all “hell”.
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Old 05-14-2021, 01:34 PM
TGBTG TGBTG is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
When people die, their soul go to a place to await resurrection. This place was referred to as the Hebrew word Sheol in the Old Testament. This word was translated into Greek in the New Testament as Hades. In the literal sense means ``grave'', but it its figurative sense refers to the afterlife place. Sheol or Hades is the adobe of the dead, the just and the unjust; however, they are separated inside Luke 16:22-23. The word Hades can also refer exclusively in a negative sense to the adobe of the wicked where they are tormented with infernal fire Luke 16:23.

Some people in this forum will disagree with me in the existence of a conscious soul after death going into a place, but that's OK . But for those that do, let me continue with my point.

Jesus did not talk much about Hades. The three passages in the Gospels were Jesus mentioned it are in Matthew 11:23 (parallel passage in Luke 10:15) referring to a judgment on a city; then Matthew 16:18 in response to Peter's confession; and then finally in Luke 16:22-23, where he details the condition of the wicked in that place. Jesus also refers to the place where the departed souls of the believers go as ``paradise'' in Luke 23:43. Hades is not yet the place of eternal destruction, so it is not yet the place of the actual eternal judgment.

There is another word that it is usually translated as ``hell'', or ``hell fire'' that refers to the eternal destruction. The Greek word is Gehenna, literally, the waste landfill outside of Jerusalem, figuratively, hell fire. This place is described as a place where destruction does not end, where there is an unquenchable fire, and where worm never dies Mark 9:43-44.
The Gospels, and Jesus himself does refer directly or through allusions to this place in many places. The word Gehenna alone appears 11 times in the Gospel, and there are at least 21 times it is referred to with allusions like fire, unquenchable fire, everlasting fire, everlasting punishment, furnace of fire, worm does not die. The ones that did not believe the Gospel will be resurrected, and judged according to their works, and thrown alive into this place as described in Revelation 20:11-15.

It is important to understand that nobody, through the entirety of human history, will be able to escape from this. The Gospels give to eternal judgment a front seat regarding relevance, more than Hades itself. Everybody will stand one day before God and be accountable to what they did with the Gospel, and their lives. In that day, nothing else will matter: fame, society acceptance, fear of men, wealth, dead works, friends and family, you name it. It will be each soul and God in a time of accountability. That is the day when everything that is secret will be revealed, and everything that is hidden will come to light Luke 8:17, Matthew 10:26, Luke 12:2, I Corinthians 4:5.

As a matter of contrast, everlasting life has more than three dozen mentions and allusions in the Gospels alone. I didn't count them all.

The more we understand what we are being saved from, the more we go on our knees grateful of this great salvation, and the mercies of God.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16 (NKJV)


Therefore, more than putting emphasis on hell as in Hades as the destiny of the wicked in evangelistic messages, the Gospel wants us to put the emphasis in eternal judgment where people stand before God, and in Gehenna, and in everlasting life.
Question: what is the purpose of giving birth to kids if there is a chance they can end up in Gehenna?
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Old 05-14-2021, 02:05 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by TGBTG View Post
Question: what is the purpose of giving birth to kids if there is a chance they can end up in Gehenna?
Do you believe there will be an eternal judgement? Where is that question coming from?
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Old 05-14-2021, 03:53 PM
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

The idea of Heaven for the righteous and Hell for sinners was introduced by Jesus Christ in the gospels. It was a new concept.
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Old 05-14-2021, 04:26 PM
TGBTG TGBTG is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
Do you believe there will be an eternal judgement?
yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
Where is that question coming from?
my random musings..it’s just something that has always been on my mind.
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Old 05-14-2021, 05:45 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by Scott Pitta View Post
The idea of Heaven for the righteous and Hell for sinners was introduced by Jesus Christ in the gospels. It was a new concept.
AFAIK, the Pharisees believed in it by the time of Christ. It wasn’t a Heaven or Hell as we understand it, but a Hades separated.
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Old 05-14-2021, 05:53 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by TGBTG View Post
yes

my random musings..it’s just something that has always been on my mind.
It is indeed a simple question with a complex answer. They could choose good and enjoy eternity with their parents if they are also saved. They could choose good and be a tremendous blessing to many, and cause many to turn to God.
There is a good chance kids will stay in the parents religion if both parents stay in that religion and stay married. That’s what the hopes are when kids are being conceived.

There are some many whys that are difficult to answer. Why have kids if this world is hard to live in and there are deseases that can make life miserable? Why some people choose God and some don’t?

Maybe you can find the answer in Ecclesiastes.
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Old 05-16-2021, 04:10 AM
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Re: Hell in the Gospels, What should be our emphas

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post

Therefore, more than putting emphasis on hell as in Hades as the destiny of the wicked in evangelistic messages, the Gospel wants us to put the emphasis in eternal judgment where people stand before God, and in Gehenna, and in everlasting life.
Hebrews 6:1-2 KJV
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, [2] Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

In this passage I see the basic elements of evangelistic preaching: repentance and faith, washings and laying on of hands (cleansing and commissioning to service), resurrection and eternal judgment.

I do NOT see in that list of basic elements a need to dwell on the intermediate state between death and judgment. So I conclude you are correct: the emphasis in evangelistic preaching should be on eternal judgment rather than the intermediate state.
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