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  #11  
Old 09-22-2021, 07:22 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

I would like to attempt to cover an area of giving that doesn’t normally get any attention. It is routinely overlooked in the Apostolic church. That is the reality that if we give something, that someone receives (benefits from) that giving.

I know that it is often the pastor but it should be many others. I believe that the standard message on giving implies that ALL Christians should give. You don’t typically hear that some Christians should receive, but the reality is that even Christians fall on hard times. I realize that this in not a popular message in the days of prosperity gospel but it’s true.

The prosperity gospel tends to make people ashamed of having needs. But when you look at the early church, there were people who had needs. When we pretend that they are less than righteous because it fits our narrative on giving, we do them and the church as a whole, disservice. It is a reckless doctrine IMHO.

Often on giving, the subject of the church selling what they had and putting the money at the apostles feet comes up. This is a scriptural example of early church giving, but the scripture doesn’t stop there. It says who received the resources. Allow me to cut and paste.

Acts 4

[32] And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
[33] And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
[34] Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
[35] And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.

You see, even in the early church where people were on fire for God and revival was going on, people were in need. It is often overlooked that the money was distributed to every man that had need. I have seen many times where the preacher who covered this passage would merely stop after the part where the money was laid at the apostles feet, implying that it was for them. It was not for them, UNLESS THEY WERE IN NEED!

So I think it’s important to complete the full circle of the giving doctrine. The scripture does. We often do not. We often are told that once we give, it’s none of our business what happens to the gift. It is simply and scripturally not true. For every gift, there is someone or something that receives and benefits from that gift. Giving is a gift of the Spirit. They who truly have this gift, in my experience also are diligent in stewardship. They go together.

I have too often heard that if someone is experiencing financial difficulties, it is caused by their lack of giving. This is often completely unfounded. Sometimes financial difficulties are very temporary. Other times they are a lifestyle.

The widow who gave her mites was obviously generous. She also had nothing more. Aaaand she was a widow. So, in spite of her generosity we never hear of her becoming independently wealthy or that she married her Prince Charming.

Giving is important. It is not for all Christians at all times. There are benefits to being in financial hardship. It can be humbling. And it can, if approached correctly, be an opportunity for the ones who have more to share with they who have need. It is a demonstration of brotherly love.

Aaaand it is absolutely scriptural!
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  #12  
Old 09-22-2021, 10:11 PM
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

One can not give what is not theirs and all that you have is God’s.

Instead of worrying about giving and tithing, simply be a good steward of that which is God’s.
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  #13  
Old 09-22-2021, 11:07 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by jfrog View Post
One can not give what is not theirs and all that you have is God’s.

Instead of worrying about giving and tithing, simply be a good steward of that which is God’s.
We all should be concerned about false doctrines, especially the ones that do coercion on giving to be able to participate in the congregation in different ministries. How it comes that false doctrines are always about getting greater access to power, sex or money?
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  #14  
Old 09-22-2021, 11:29 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by jfrog View Post
One can not give what is not theirs and all that you have is God’s.

Instead of worrying about giving and tithing, simply be a good steward of that which is God’s.
Thank you Ram Dass
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  #15  
Old 09-23-2021, 03:07 AM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
I have the feeling EB, smartly, created this thread to just get us out of Scott's one
Flypaper?

Lol
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  #16  
Old 09-23-2021, 07:02 AM
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Nicodemus1968 Nicodemus1968 is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
It’s very plain. It’s easy to do. Don’t make it more difficult than it is. Just follow the directions. Don’t add to it or take away from it. Don’t ignore it. Teach it, preach it and do it.
I wouldn’t say its easy to do.

We talk about giving, and its all just stuff weather it be money, food, clothing, etc. Yet, it really comes down to our life, our desires, our dreams have to be submitted to him (Jesus).

Moses saw great things, the exodus from Egypt, the Red Sea divided, the earth open, the Hinder parts of God. And through all that he never prayed anything for himself. He had a faith that all he needed was going to be supplied by his master. Someone talks about God doing that for them, and they’re ridiculed, they’re mocked. We have an America mentality that its every man for himself, work, work, work to provide for your family. Never allowing God to provide for you and your family.

We’re so concerned with the news and whats going around, the only things the prophets, apostles, disciples were concderned about was Gods work. Where the Spirit lead them, not the ways of the world.

Luke 12:16-21
[16] And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully:
[17] And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits?
[18] And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods.
[19] And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry.
[20] But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?
[21] So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.
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  #17  
Old 09-23-2021, 07:28 AM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
Flypaper?

Lol
Indeed!
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  #18  
Old 09-23-2021, 07:48 AM
1 God 1 God is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Does God only want volunteer giving? Jesus' ministry is only about volunteers. Even though Jesus hand picked His group He took them out of their vocations. Telling them that once they use to fish for fish, but now their real vocation is about catching men. They were told that any house they entered into they were to wish peace upon that home. Anything that was set before them, they were to partake in that meal. They were to bring no supplies, no money, yet they would be taken care of and not by asking for it. They were like the children of Israel leaving Egypt. So in that way they would allow God to provide. Not extorting money, like Simon the Sorcerer. Healing and delivering people for a payment. But doing everything without asking for anything in return.
Amen....Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
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  #19  
Old 09-24-2021, 09:20 AM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

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Amen....Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
Just as a reminder, this passage is concerning helping the poor saints of Jerusalem. It was not for the “ministry” only. Helping the poor has much greater New Testament scriptural support than giving to pastors does. After all, aren’t we all supposed to be in the ministry?

There are entire conferences held that are exclusively for the ministry. There is no greater division in the church than the one between the pulpit and the pew.

1Cor.3

[3] For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

1Cor.1

[10] Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

Paul discouraged any division in the church. He was of the opinion that different saints had different gifts. Some gifts were more desirable than others but the people that had the gifts were not exalted above others. Doing so was a sign of carnality.
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  #20  
Old 09-24-2021, 03:20 PM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: “God wants ONLY volunteer giving”

Each man according to his ability. Each man according to his need.
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