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  #21  
Old 06-20-2021, 04:30 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by Monterrey View Post
Sigh.

Went to church this AM and received the tithe and offering envelopes. ..

Man it's rough being a pastor.

Taught on prosperity as I drove up in my Ford King Ranch, diesel, with gooseneck horse trailer to haul my horses...

Just put a well on the five acres I bought, gotta have somewhere to put my horses.

Thought about driving my restored 76 vette, or the 1964 1/2 Mustang. .. chose the King Ranch instead.

Hope I have enough bank bags to haul all the loot...
Five acres?

For your horses?

You obviously must not have very many horses. Two? Miniature ponies to carry a miniature man? I keep chickens on more land than that. It sounds like you need an offering.
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  #22  
Old 06-20-2021, 04:35 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

Hehehe.
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  #23  
Old 06-20-2021, 04:39 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
Oh Steve Epley. He pastors an independent apostolic church. I wonder what they believe that makes the church independent.
Invite him back on here and maybe he’ll tell it. I believe he was once AMF. They believed strongly in not sharing the tithe with a certain organization.
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  #24  
Old 06-20-2021, 04:56 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Invite him back on here and maybe he’ll tell it. I believe he was once AMF. They believed strongly in not sharing the tithe with a certain organization.
Heres a little back and forth that I had with Steve Epley. He didn’t seem to believe in a preacher having to be bothered with supporting his position with scripture. He’s a nice guy though. What little there is of him.

Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
What part of NOT with gold do you not understand?
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Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
1Tim. 2:9 is clearer. Not with gold.
Brother Epley, first of all thanks for responding. Let’s dig into this a little deeper. Perhaps we can come to agreement, even if we should agree to disagree. I’ll try to be respectful about it.

First of all, these passages are very similar. They (in my opinion at least) are saying the same thing. I earlier quoted Peter, whose ministry was primarily to the Jews and you quoted Paul whose ministry was primarily to the Gentiles.

Both passages are allegorical in nature. They should not be taken literally. The proof of this is something that we have already touched on when i asked if you preached against wearing apparel as well. If we were to interpret this passage literally this would be the case. I think we agree that these passages are not literal but allegorical in nature. I believe that you are mixing the two, (allegorical and literal) interpretations. I believe you are in error when you do so.

You believe that Paul’s version is clearer. I believe Peter’s version is. One thing is sure, neither says that wearing jewelry is a sin.

An allegory is a story wherein something literal represents something else. In this case the apparel that would be clothing for our natural bodies, represents our hearts. What both Peter and Paul are saying is that man looks on the outer appearance but God looks on the heart. It is an allegory. Man looks on the fine clothes, the gold and the broided hair but God looks at the meek and quiet spirit (Peter) or the shamefacedness and sobriety (Paul). Further evidence that Paul is speaking allegorically is when he refers to women being clothed in good works.

Continued
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Old 02-09-2019, 08:11 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Hair, sleeves, pantsuits, jewelry, and makeup
Continued

The question is, should we also interpret this literally? Would we be in error to do so. I believe we would. However the evidence may be considered inconclusive at this point. So perhaps we should look for other sources. There are two more that I can think of. One is allegorical and the other literal. They may lend a little more color to the picture.

Ezek.16

[1] Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
[2] Son of man, cause Jerusalem to know her abominations,
[3] And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD unto Jerusalem; Thy birth and thy nativity is of the land of Canaan; thy father was an Amorite, and thy mother an Hittite.
[4] And as for thy nativity, in the day thou wast born thy navel was not cut, neither wast thou washed in water to supple thee; thou wast not salted at all, nor swaddled at all.
[5] None eye pitied thee, to do any of these unto thee, to have compassion upon thee; but thou wast cast out in the open field, to the lothing of thy person, in the day that thou wast born.
[6] And when I passed by thee, and saw thee polluted in thine own blood, I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live; yea, I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live.
[7] I have caused thee to multiply as the bud of the field, and thou hast increased and waxen great, and thou art come to excellent ornaments: thy breasts are fashioned, and thine hair is grown, whereas thou wast naked and bare.
[8] Now when I passed by thee, and looked upon thee, behold, thy time was the time of love; and I spread my skirt over thee, and covered thy nakedness: yea, I sware unto thee, and entered into a covenant with thee, saith the Lord GOD, and thou becamest mine.
[9] Then washed I thee with water; yea, I throughly washed away thy blood from thee, and I anointed thee with oil.
[10] I clothed thee also with broidered work, and shod thee with badgers' skin, and I girded thee about with fine linen, and I covered thee with silk.
[11] I decked thee also with ornaments, and I put bracelets upon thy hands, and a chain on thy neck.
[12] And I put a jewel on thy forehead, and earrings in thine ears, and a beautiful crown upon thine head.
[13] Thus wast thou decked with gold and silver; and thy raiment was of fine linen, and silk, and broidered work; thou didst eat fine flour, and honey, and oil: and thou wast exceeding beautiful, and thou didst prosper into a kingdom.

This is another allegorical story where Israel is the woman that God is in covenant with. It is a beautiful story that obviously is not in any way meant to be taken literally. Some may consider it a type of the church and Jesus even.

In the context of jewelry being sin, notice that God is pretty much blinging out his bride with jewelry and fine apparel. Now we know that God is without sin and while this is obviously an allegory, wouldn’t it be odd for God to use sinful jewelry to make a point even? These are the words of God as recorded in Ezekiel. It is evident to me that God has no problem with jewelry.
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  #25  
Old 06-20-2021, 05:01 PM
Monterrey Monterrey is offline
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

Just a little tip my friend Tithe miester...

Please refrain from naming names, like Steve E or others.

Just my .02
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  #26  
Old 06-20-2021, 05:15 PM
Tithesmeister Tithesmeister is online now
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by Monterrey View Post
Just a little tip my friend Tithe miester...

Please refrain from naming names, like Steve E or others.

Just my .02
Just a tip brother.

Steve Epley is his screen name.

You’re welcome.
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  #27  
Old 06-20-2021, 05:40 PM
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by Monterrey View Post
Just a little tip my friend Tithe miester...

Please refrain from naming names, like Steve E or others.

Just my .02
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
Just a tip brother.

Steve Epley is his screen name.

You’re welcome.
He got you there
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  #28  
Old 06-21-2021, 01:14 PM
Jito463 Jito463 is offline
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
Well, at least we have some common ground. We both believe in evidence. I commend you brother for demanding evidence (scripture that is in the correct context) that supports my position. I’m willing and able to provide it. There is no shortage.

Just a thought.

Did you require any evidence from the other side of the debate?

Tell me what you need evidence for and I will be happy to provide it.

Meanwhile, please provide evidence that the tithe was ever rendered in money once in the entire Bible. I don’t believe you can.
No, no, no. You misunderstand me completely. You didn't say they were wrong, you explicitly called every one of them lying fraudsters. I want evidence that they're lying fraudsters.

I'll wait.
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  #29  
Old 06-21-2021, 09:22 PM
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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No, no, no. You misunderstand me completely. You didn't say they were wrong, you explicitly called every one of them lying fraudsters. I want evidence that they're lying fraudsters.

I'll wait.
The difference being intent.
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  #30  
Old 06-22-2021, 07:24 AM
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Re: Jim & Tammy Faye Bakker/The PTL Club Controver

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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
Heres a little back and forth that I had with Steve Epley. He didn’t seem to believe in a preacher having to be bothered with supporting his position with scripture. He’s a nice guy though. What little there is of him.

This is another allegorical story where Israel is the woman that God is in covenant with. It is a beautiful story that obviously is not in any way meant to be taken literally. Some may consider it a type of the church and Jesus even.

In the context of jewelry being sin, notice that God is pretty much blinging out his bride with jewelry and fine apparel. Now we know that God is without sin and while this is obviously an allegory, wouldn’t it be odd for God to use sinful jewelry to make a point even? These are the words of God as recorded in Ezekiel. It is evident to me that God has no problem with jewelry.
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Lol!

Maybe in our generation well see Pastors and Elders allowing piercing in the ears and nose on the platform preaching. I mean why not, they’re letting down the whole beard and mustache “stance”.

I remember an elder prophesying over a church that in the matter of ten years that church would allow mixed swimming. If I remember correctly, they allowed for men and women, boys and girls to swim together in swimming suits. After it was going on, they were going through some tapes, and came across a certain tape and the Pastor I believed played it. Well, it was that man of God prophesying over the church concerning the mixed swimming.... Whoops

Like Murray Burr quoted in one of his many books, “when you stand for nothing, you’ll fall for anything.”
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