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  #1  
Old 10-01-2008, 11:29 AM
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Ferd Ferd is offline
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Obama is lying to you. What will YOU do about it?

More importantly if he really is lying about some things, how can you trust him about ANYTHING?

Some surely wont believe that simple statement so lets explore.
What are the lies?

1. Anyone listening to Barak Obama has heard him say that 95% of Americans will receive a tax cut.
The problem is, Somewhere just north of 35% of American tax payers pay no income taxes!

Barak Obama says 95% of Americans will get a tax cut. but 35% of Americans don't pay anything at all right now. You cant cut their taxes. You can however send them a check for not paying any taxes.... and that is exactly what he will do.

Effectively that means that middle income families will write their checks to the government for their income taxes, and the IRS will simply endorse those checks and send them to other Americans in a form of welfare that isn't actually codified in the law.

Barak is lying to you about this tax cut.


Here is a link to a media matters article that explains that 37.2% of Americans pay no income tax. Media Matters is a far left organization. The article is very critical of anything approaching a conservative view. I chose this article because any conservative article would be viewed as biased. Additionally there is a link in the article to Tax Policy Center that shows who pays what.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200506100002

2. Barak Obama says he will cut Capital Gains taxes for Small businesses.The argument is that Obama's tax plan will raise taxes on small businesses because most of them file their taxes as individuals. Thus their business income appears as high income wage earners and will therefore have their tax rate rise from 35% to 39%. But Obama has made a big deal about offsetting this by eliminating the Capital Gains taxes these small businesses pay.

Here is the dirty little secret. Small businesses don't pay capital gains taxes. That is right. Capital Gains taxes don't apply to a small business.

Here is how Capital Gains works. You buy a property, or an asset, over time that asset gains value. You then sell it. the difference between your purchase price and the price you sell that asset is the Capital gain.
But small business don't do this. Small businesses either provide a service for which they are paid, or they take raw material and manufacture some product that they sell. In either case, their income is considered taxable income at either the personal tax rate or at some corporate tax rate.
Their only Capital Gain is the value of their business....The only way a small business earns a Capital Gain most often is to sell the business!
Barak Obama is lying when he suggests cutting Capital Gains taxes for small businesses will either help small businesses or will help the economy. This is simply a lie.


So the question that begs to be answered is, if Barak Obama will lie to you about these very important issues, what else is he lying about???????
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  #2  
Old 10-01-2008, 12:01 PM
Light Light is offline
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Re: Obama is lying to you. What will YOU do about

Quote:
Originally Posted by ferd View Post
more importantly if he really is lying about some things, how can you trust him about anything?

Some surely wont believe that simple statement so lets explore.
What are the lies?

1. Anyone listening to barak obama has heard him say that 95% of americans will receive a tax cut.
The problem is, somewhere just north of 35% of american tax payers pay no income taxes!

barak obama says 95% of americans will get a tax cut. But 35% of americans don't pay anything at all right now. You cant cut their taxes. You can however send them a check for not paying any taxes.... And that is exactly what he will do.

Effectively that means that middle income families will write their checks to the government for their income taxes, and the irs will simply endorse those checks and send them to other americans in a form of welfare that isn't actually codified in the law.

Barak is lying to you about this tax cut.


Here is a link to a media matters article that explains that 37.2% of americans pay no income tax. Media matters is a far left organization. The article is very critical of anything approaching a conservative view. I chose this article because any conservative article would be viewed as biased. Additionally there is a link in the article to tax policy center that shows who pays what.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200506100002

2. barak obama says he will cut capital gains taxes for small businesses.the argument is that obama's tax plan will raise taxes on small businesses because most of them file their taxes as individuals. Thus their business income appears as high income wage earners and will therefore have their tax rate rise from 35% to 39%. But obama has made a big deal about offsetting this by eliminating the capital gains taxes these small businesses pay.

Here is the dirty little secret. small businesses don't pay capital gains taxes. that is right. Capital gains taxes don't apply to a small business.

Here is how capital gains works. You buy a property, or an asset, over time that asset gains value. You then sell it. The difference between your purchase price and the price you sell that asset is the capital gain.
But small business don't do this. Small businesses either provide a service for which they are paid, or they take raw material and manufacture some product that they sell. In either case, their income is considered taxable income at either the personal tax rate or at some corporate tax rate.
Their only capital gain is the value of their business....the only way a small business earns a capital gain most often is to sell the business!
barak obama is lying when he suggests cutting capital gains taxes for small businesses will either help small businesses or will help the economy. This is simply a lie.


so the question that begs to be answered is, if barak obama will lie to you about these very important issues, what else is he lying about???????
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  #3  
Old 10-01-2008, 12:18 PM
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Ferd Ferd is offline
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Re: Obama is lying to you. What will YOU do about

Light, I just pointed out substantive lies told by a candidate for president. by substantive, I mean these are points that are central to his candidacy.

i would be more than happy to join a discussion about such lies (meeting the above criteria) about John McCain. Please start a thread and lets review the information.

But are you saying here that what I said above isnt true? Are you saying that you belive that 95% of Americans can actuall get a tax cut? That cutting capital gains taxes on Small Businesses is a substantive approach that will be a benifit to small businesses?

really?

As for WMDs in Iraq, not every time you are wrong are you lying. In fact every single major intelegence group including the french and germans (who were against our going into Iraq) said Saddam had WMDs. That was not a lie. and it certainly wasnt a lie told by John McCain.


AGAIN, please provide an actual point of debat about something John McCain has as a centerpiece of his campaign and we can discuss with respect if it is a lie or not.

I contend that Barak has lied in a very substantive way about a very important part of his economic plan. It is an important issue.

If you dont agree, please point out the flaw in the logic. I am more than willing to talk about it with respect and honesty.
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Last edited by Ferd; 10-01-2008 at 01:13 PM.
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  #4  
Old 10-01-2008, 12:47 PM
Light Light is offline
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Re: Obama is lying to you. What will YOU do about

Ferd I deleted my post as it was out of line. You are a honorable brother in the Lord and I know you do not tolerate lying. Please if you would delete it from your post also.
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  #5  
Old 10-01-2008, 01:15 PM
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Ferd Ferd is offline
I remain the Petulant Chevalier


 
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Re: Obama is lying to you. What will YOU do about

Quote:
Originally Posted by Light View Post
Ferd I deleted my post as it was out of line. You are a honorable brother in the Lord and I know you do not tolerate lying. Please if you would delete it from your post also.
Done. however, if you dont agree, i would sure like to discuss it....


and if you feel that John McCain is lying about parts of his plan that are central to his campaign, I would sure like to see that too.

I think this is important that we are able to discuss it reasonably.

This is the kind of information that every voter needs.... from both sides.
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