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  #11  
Old 02-01-2017, 08:14 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by RonMurray View Post
It's not a perversion of the gospel. I went to God and asked Him if it eas true that everyone who receives the Holy Ghost will speak in tongues. And He answered by leading me to Isaiah 28:11 & 12 and opened my understanding of it, and showed me the connection between that and what Jesus said in Matthew 11:28, and made me to know that it's true, that everyone who receives the Holy Spirit will speak in tongues. So this is what God Himself teaches.
Why was John filled with the Holy Ghost, before Pentecost? How could that be without any record of him speaking in tongues?

On the Day of Pentecost, those who received the HG spoke in languages that people around could understand. Did you receive the HG in that same way? Did you speak in a language that was easily understood by others around you? If not, how then can you say you have truly received the same experience as they?

How do you explain this verse:
Mark 16:15-20
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.


VS. 16 says he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved, but he that believeth not shall be damned. Notice tongues is not mentioned there.

The signs that will follow them that believe are
-cast out devils
-speak with new tongues
- take up serpents
- drink any deadly thing
- lay hands on the sick.

Tongues are a sign, and not salvational. This is quite simply STATED in this passage.

Otherwise, in order for this verse to line up with the rest of this theology, you would also have to cast out devils, speak with new tongues, taken up serpents, drank any deadly thing, and lay hands on the sick in order to be saved.

But this verse does not say that.

Again, tongues are a sign, and are not salvational. I speak in tongues, and I know they are a powerful gift from the Lord. But I don't depend on my gift of tongues for salvation.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. Simple words from Jesus himself.
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  #12  
Old 02-01-2017, 08:35 PM
Jito463 Jito463 is offline
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord View Post
Again, tongues are a sign, and are not salvational. I speak in tongues, and I know they are a powerful gift from the Lord. But I don't depend on my gift of tongues for salvation.
Technically, they're evidence. And no one I know believes they're "salvational", merely that when one receives the baptism of the Holy Ghost for the first time, they will speak in tongues. To call them salvational, implies that speaking in tongues will save you. That's a fallacious argument.
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  #13  
Old 02-01-2017, 08:46 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by Jito463 View Post
Technically, they're evidence. And no one I know believes they're "salvational", merely that when one receives the baptism of the Holy Ghost for the first time, they will speak in tongues. To call them salvational, implies that speaking in tongues will save you. That's a fallacious argument.
Well, let's look at that "fallacious argument". If you don't speak in tongues, are you saved or not?
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2017, 08:50 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord View Post
Why was John filled with the Holy Ghost, before Pentecost? How could that be without any record of him speaking in tongues?

On the Day of Pentecost, those who received the HG spoke in languages that people around could understand. Did you receive the HG in that same way? Did you speak in a language that was easily understood by others around you? If not, how then can you say you have truly received the same experience as they?

How do you explain this verse:
Mark 16:15-20
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.


VS. 16 says he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved, but he that believeth not shall be damned. Notice tongues is not mentioned there.

The signs that will follow them that believe are
-cast out devils
-speak with new tongues
- take up serpents
- drink any deadly thing
- lay hands on the sick.

Tongues are a sign, and not salvational. This is quite simply STATED in this passage.

Otherwise, in order for this verse to line up with the rest of this theology, you would also have to cast out devils, speak with new tongues, taken up serpents, drank any deadly thing, and lay hands on the sick in order to be saved.

But this verse does not say that.

Again, tongues are a sign, and are not salvational. I speak in tongues, and I know they are a powerful gift from the Lord. But I don't depend on my gift of tongues for salvation.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. Simple words from Jesus himself.
If you have a hard time with it, go to God and ask Him about it like I did. God shiwed me in His word by His Spirit and opened my understanding of it. The word of God is spiritually discerned, and sometimes we don't see or understand something, but that doesn't mean it's not true, we just don't see it, and we need God to show us.

PS - If you read the article, you'll see I explained that tongues itself doesn't save us, being filled with the Holy Spirit does, and speaking in tongues is a result of being filled with the Holy Spirit.

Last edited by RonMurray; 02-01-2017 at 08:57 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:17 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord View Post
Well, let's look at that "fallacious argument". If you don't speak in tongues, are you saved or not?
People aren't saved by works, but if you got no works, are you saved or not?
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  #16  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:20 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord View Post

On the Day of Pentecost, those who received the HG spoke in languages that people around could understand. Did you receive the HG in that same way? Did you speak in a language that was easily understood by others around you? If not, how then can you say you have truly received the same experience as they?
So you don't believe that tongues are the sign of the baptism with the Holy Ghost? Unless people understand what you are saying?
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  #17  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:23 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
People aren't saved by works, but if you got no works, are you saved or not?
Aren't works a sign that would follow?

The act of obedience for initial salvation is to believe, and be baptized.

It seems works would be what follows obedience. Works are not salvation, but if one is obedient works will follow. ... these things shall FOLLOW them that believe.
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  #18  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:26 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by RonMurray View Post
If you have a hard time with it, go to God and ask Him about it like I did. God shiwed me in His word by His Spirit and opened my understanding of it. The word of God is spiritually discerned, and sometimes we don't see or understand something, but that doesn't mean it's not true, we just don't see it, and we need God to show us.

PS - If you read the article, you'll see I explained that tongues itself doesn't save us, being filled with the Holy Spirit does, and speaking in tongues is a result of being filled with the Holy Spirit.
I appreciate your attitude about this. I do believe that we should pray and ask the Lord to open our hearts to the word of God, amen.

So in your p.s. are you saying that you don't believe that tongues are salvational?

In other words, if one doesn't speak in tongues are they saved, or not?
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  #19  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:28 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
So you don't believe that tongues are the sign of the baptism with the Holy Ghost? Unless people understand what you are saying?
Simply put, what Mark 16:15-20 says, I believe. It says tongues are a sign that follow. It does not include tongues with salvation.
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  #20  
Old 02-01-2017, 09:47 PM
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Re: Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongue

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Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord View Post
Aren't works a sign that would follow?

The act of obedience for initial salvation is to believe, and be baptized.

It seems works would be what follows obedience. Works are not salvation, but if one is obedient works will follow. ... these things shall FOLLOW them that believe.
So a lack of works is a sign of lack of obedience. And therefore, as applied to tongues...?
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