??? for the attorneys and pastors here

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Sam

It is my understanding (might be wrong) that in the confessional the priest is not obligated to reveal what has been said. I think something happened like that with OJ Simpson but that was not a Roman Catholic situation. I think OJ Simpson had told Rosie something that might have been used in convicting him but because Rosie was speaking to him in a position of praying for him he did not have to reveal what was said.

Rosie Greer. We don't know what if any confession was made however I believe they did try to subpoena either him or a jail guard who overheard it and it was rejected

[Sam]

Originally Posted by missourimary

I've never been to confessional, but I thought the priest wasn't supposed to be able to see the person who was confessing, but only to hear the confession?

In the old confessional booths there was a screen between the one confessing and the one hearing the confession. But confession could be done openly just about anywhere on a one to one basis. Confession has changed. You can now sit down with the priest and confess to him openly. And, there is also a way for everyone in the congregation to stand and whoever wants to can confess privately and silently to God. I don't remember the terms used for those practices.

I remember going to a healing service at a Roman Catholic Church several years ago. Two or three people would stand in the front as a prayer team and you could go up there and receive individual prayer from the team for healing. Some times they would pray for your in tongues or they might prophesy over you. Off to the side, in a place where the choir ordinarily sat, a priest was available (I think in non-clergy garb) and anyone could go there, sit down with him and confess.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by Margies3

or anyone else who might really have knowledge about this............

Let's say a member of a congregation has done something very, very wrong (sexually). This person goes to the pastor in confidence and spills his guts - all the disgusting details. In the meantime, the police are called in (not by the pastor) and the person is arrested for their crimes. AFTER the police have arrested this person and taken them away, the pastor then files a written report with the police regarding what he knows about the situation.

My questions are several:
1) How much is the pastor OBLIGATED by law to put in his written report?
2) Should he even be filing a written report? Or does pastor confidentially exclude him from doing that?
3) Where is that "fine line" drawn in a situation like this?

I know that as a daycare provider if I know of abuse or neglect, I am obligated by law to call the authorities. But what I would know would not have been shared with me in the kind of confidential situation that a pastor/parishioner would share. So is there a difference?

Please don't think I am bashing any pastor here. I am simply asking a question. Thanks.

California is VERY tough on this stuff and I've been in awkward situations a couple of times and had to call the police once which resulted is everyone wanting to wring my neck. Problem is, if I don't call and something happens and I knew a person had committed similar acts, my butt's in a sling.

I now begin every serious counseling session with the disclaimer..."If you have committed certain crimes (certain crimes are exempt from this), do not confess it to me unless you understand in advance that I am required by law to call the police."

Interestingly though, Catholic priests get more room with this in confessionals than protestant pastors.

[MissBrattified]

What I've heard before (and I think it was my pastor who said it, but I'm not for certain, Margie) is that the pastor tells the person about to spill his guts: If you confess a crime, I'm required by law to report it. That way, they have fair warning before they lay it all out there, and the confessor can't hate the pastor for doing what he said he would do. (Well, they can, but they shouldn't, if they're crazy enough to share felonious secrets anyway.)

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

What I've heard before (and I think it was my pastor who said it, but I'm not for certain, Margie) is that the pastor tells the person about to spill his guts: If you confess a crime, I'm required by law to report it. That way, they have fair warning before they lay it all out there, and the confessor can't hate the pastor for doing what he said he would do. (Well, they can, but they shouldn't, if they're crazy enough to share felonious secrets anyway.)

Yep...just wrote that. I had to learn the hard way. Bible school taught me how to figure out Romans 3:23. It did not teacher me how to live in the real world.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by notofworks

Yep...just wrote that. I had to learn the hard way. Bible school taught me how to figure out Romans 3:23. It did not teacher me how to live in the real world.

Sounds smart to me.

Personally, I think there are some things people should only confess to God. I don't want to know. Why do people feel like they have to tell another person in order to receive forgiveness? Doesn't it seem like that? That people have a need to confess?

I know of someone who carries around loads of guilt because they never resolved issues with a parent who is now dead. It can't ever be resolved. Does that mean they're going to hell because they never made restitution? At some point you have to trust God's mercy, and don't kill yourself trying to deserve it.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Sounds smart to me.

Personally, I think there are some things people should only confess to God. I don't want to know. Why do people feel like they have to tell another person in order to receive forgiveness? Doesn't it seem like that? That people have a need to confess?

I know of someone who carries around loads of guilt because they never resolved issues with a parent who is now dead. It can't ever be resolved. Does that mean they're going to hell because they never made restitution? At some point you have to trust God's mercy, and don't kill yourself trying to deserve it.

That story reminds me of the great song by Mike and the Mechanics, "Living Years."

There's something about "unloading" that can make a person feel better but often, the impulse to "unload" is a selfish one. Quite frequently, the guy who just gushed feels better and the person to whom he gushed feels horrible, especially if the listener is directly affected by what he's done. There are a lot of people who greatly encourage people to confess everything, but I agree, there is no biblical directive to always do that and some things are better left unsaid and resolved with God alone.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Sounds smart to me.

Personally, I think there are some things people should only confess to God. I don't want to know. Why do people feel like they have to tell another person in order to receive forgiveness? Doesn't it seem like that? That people have a need to confess?

I know of someone who carries around loads of guilt because they never resolved issues with a parent who is now dead. It can't ever be resolved. Does that mean they're going to hell because they never made restitution? At some point you have to trust God's mercy, and don't kill yourself trying to deserve it.

These are the 12 steps of AA (Alcoholics Anonymous)

Notice steps 5-9 about confession and restitution.

These are the original Twelve Steps as published by Alcoholics Anonymous:

1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.
2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
7. Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
10. Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

[Baron1710]

It varies by state how much is required, Alaska was or is dealing with this question. Pastors there were/are (not sure of the current status) NOT required to reveal anything. This was a news worthy story in the legal community because it was an exception. Most states require that if it involves children you are required to report it. After that you have to check your state and local laws. Some states allow for more confidentiality than others.

With attorneys a third party often destroys confidentiality (Obvious exceptions apply).

[Baron1710]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Sounds smart to me.

Personally, I think there are some things people should only confess to God. I don't want to know. Why do people feel like they have to tell another person in order to receive forgiveness? Doesn't it seem like that? That people have a need to confess?

I know of someone who carries around loads of guilt because they never resolved issues with a parent who is now dead. It can't ever be resolved. Does that mean they're going to hell because they never made restitution? At some point you have to trust God's mercy, and don't kill yourself trying to deserve it.

Rational thinking people don't have sex with children. So is it a stretch that they would confess it to someone? I just read about one that was bragging online and that was how he got caught.